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Falcon Boy
05-16-2007, 09:13 PM
Well today i picked up my new hunting partner for the next few years. After 3 plane delays and 3 hours, i finally have him in hand. His name is Goose, he is a male gyr/saker and is approx. 18 days old. Here are some pics from his first feeding.

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day18001.jpg

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day18003.jpg

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day18005.jpg

And his "imprint tank"

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day18004.jpg


And dad the silver gyr-
http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/father.jpg

And mom the saker
http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/mother.jpg

wesleyc6
05-16-2007, 09:41 PM
congrats Noah. That is a big ol' baby!!!!! A face only a falconer could love. [smilie=eusa_doh.gif] I think they are so neat looking. I can't wait to hear your stories!!!!!! Nice pics and nice digs he has.

`Chris L.
05-16-2007, 09:50 PM
Congrats Noah,
he looks great. Keep us posted on the progress

Falcon Boy
05-17-2007, 08:07 AM
So far so good, he is getting quieter, isnt biting nearly as much, and taking the hood a little better. Eating like a champ as well!

Wes, i owe you great thanks for the astroturf with a sheet on top idea, he poops ALOT and this is 100000x easier to clean than pea gravel would have been!

Jimmy
05-17-2007, 10:10 AM
Geez, that thing is ugly........
Good luck with him, Noel. How does it feel to have bought a bird, but yet not legally own it?

Falcon Boy
05-17-2007, 10:48 AM
I don't mind, not planning on doing anything that would get it taken away from me. [smilie=dontknow.gif]

ps- my name is Noah, like the ark [smilie=icon_thumright.gif]

Jimmy
05-17-2007, 10:58 AM
Sorry about the name typo. I knew your name, but just f-ed up...

Falcon Boy
05-17-2007, 11:00 AM
No biggie, nobody says my name right [smilie=smileys13.gif]

Saluqi
05-17-2007, 11:08 AM
Nice Noah! Congratulations! What's the deal with the two bands?

Paul

Falcon Boy
05-17-2007, 11:22 AM
Couldnt tell ya [smilie=dontknow.gif] Sent an email to find out a minute ago.

**EDIT**

Just got an email back, the blue one is just a breeder band and i can cut it off if i want to.

Rudd
05-17-2007, 11:36 AM
Congrats. Dad looks awsome!

wesleyc6
05-17-2007, 12:32 PM
Yeah, they do poop a lot and hard surfaced don't absorb, so it makes it easier if you can just remove two pieces and be done. You will have to rinse out his box all along because it will seep down the edges occaisionally. Use the time that he is eating to take him outside and let him eat on the ground(if ants aren't a problem) and you can hose out his box and put the new turf and sheets in there. It gets pretty easy to clean up behind the little guy for a couple of weeks and then it gets to be more work when he starts roaming about. [smilie=eusa_clap.gif]

buteoflyer2000
05-17-2007, 02:20 PM
Oh my goodness, what a cutie. His parents are beautiful. Hmm... raptor diapers .. wanders off think about that...

Shortwingn
05-17-2007, 05:01 PM
Nice looking bird! Bunnies beware.

Falcon Boy
05-17-2007, 05:06 PM
The nest box just wasnt working out. I'd go to the bathroom, come back and he had pooped but not made it out of the nest box, then turned around and belly flopped in it. So i did away with the nest box and am now using this-

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day19.jpg

He kept getting out of the nest box anyway, probably did it 5/6 times today just walking around "exploring" so i dont think he will be detrimented [if im wrong please correct me].

Anyone know an easy way to get bird crap off his down feathers? It looks like... well... crap. I had never thought he could damage the way he looked so quickly, i was gone for 2min, come back and his neck is covered in poo and he's laying in it. I got most of it off his beak, but when i tried to wipe it off the down it just smeared. Any ideas?

Falcon Boy
05-17-2007, 11:20 PM
From here out, i plan on using this thread as a training log. A mirror of it appears on my forum as well. Any/all advice is of course welcome!

Day 19-
6am- fed full crop. Screamed a bit after but quieted down quickly. Put in kitchen with kids getting ready for school. Did much better with hood and hands in box. Last night he didnít go to the edge of his nest bowl to poop so he just shot it across the nest, and then apparently changed sides. Now he has some mutes around his beak/wings/feet. Iíll try and clean it off later today.

10am- Screamed while eating for first minute or so, easily distracted at first, but once he realized there was food nothing would distract him, including a train going by outside with the window open. Fed full crop. Getting much better about noise and hands. Slept most the time from 6-10. Still doesnít like the hood, screams and dodges, have to work on that more. I took him out for about half hour and he was noisy outside his box for the first 5-10 minutes but after that he just looked around for a while, took a few steps and flapped a bit, then laid down next to me and fell asleep. I cleaned his tank out as well.

1pm- Took goose outside for an hour and a half near a road. He walked around, bit at grass, etc. Was pretty vocal when he wasnít near me, but heíd make his way too me then hush up for most the time. His crop got empty and he started being more vocal so I fed him another full crop of food outdoors, where he wasnít fazed at all by the cars/trucks going by. He hooded much better this time.

445pm- Goose slept most of the time from after his last feeding until now. When he was awake he was generally silent. If I walked into the room after being gone for a minute heíd make two peeps, sort of like an I know you I guess, then go right back to sleep. Getting the hood on was ok, still not great, he tries to dodge a bit. Feeding went well, gobbled down everything. About 20min before he ate he pooped, turned around and tried to walkÖ once again face planting into it [I was out of the room when it happened]. Since he keeps doing it I got rid of the nest box idea as its not working out [I donít like my bird covered in poopÖ.] and now just have the towels down on top of the turf.

745pm- Well took Goose on a car ride, other than that he pretty much slept the entire time. He made a few peeps in the car but quieted down after 2-3min. Once home he slept until 730 when he started vocalizing again. I got his food, hooded him [did ok, still not good] put the food down, and let him eat. He is learning that the hood coming off equals food, as soon as it was off he kept vocalizing, looked left, looked right and dove right into the food and got a full crop. It looks like I will have to feed him every 3hrs if not a big less. I am going to try and feed him from now on BEFORE he starts vocalizing, perhaps every 2.5hrs I will offer food. I would leave food in there with him all the time, but he has a tendency to poop every direction and I donít want to waste the food. I put him in the kitchen on the floor during dinner and afterwards with the whole family around [8 people]. He was silent as a stone until he was hungry and started whining. I can now see the tips of the wing feathers coming through the shafts, about 1cm past the end. You can just barely see the tip of the tail feather, they arenít quite pushing out yet. I have been able to see the wing feathers all day, and they were not visible yesterday. His secondaryís are the farthest out of all his feathers, and they look to be saker-brown, so it should be interesting to see what he looks like. I am amazed at how fast he is growing. He eats about 4-6x the amount of food an adult hawk would per day.

1030pm- Goose slept a majority of the time between his last feeding and now. He was silent the entire time he was awake though, which was GREAT. He spent a good portion of time, probably 10-1030pm just lying around with his eyes open, letting me pet him, etc, never issuing a peep. He hooded better than earlier before feeding, only dodged once then sat pretty well with the hood on, just squeaked a bit. He ate right away in front of the mini-doxie that was jumping up and down constantly and barking. They had a gate and 6Ē between them and the bird didnít even bat an eye. He hooded near perfectly after his meal, and then I let him and the dog head bob at each other for about 5-10min while I cleaned the imprint tank. Now he is back in his tank, asleep hopefully for the night.

Reflection on the day- Today overall went very well in my opinion. I learned that Iím going to have to predict his hunger to avoid screaming. Once I did that [1030pm feeding] he was a perfect gentleman. If I wait too long [1pm] then he becomes vocal quickly.

Today Goose learned about my hand. Yesterday night he would scream incessantly whenever he saw me, and if I put my hand in the tank he would bite it and scream louder. If he was quiet, Iíd take my hand out. Well I did that all last night and he started taking the hint, going from about 5min to 1min of screaming before quiet. This evening he isnít screaming at all and defiantly not biting when I put my hand in.

Once problem we encountered was smell. I had been using Astroturf [long leaf] covered with a sheet. Well the sheet doesnít absorb anything, and his mutes reek. I donít care, but my mom sure as hell does. What I figured out works best for me now is I removed his nest box [he was jumping out and having a pooping issue in it which Iíll cover in a minute] and removed the sheet covering all of the Astroturf. I then put down a small square of sheet about ľ the size of the imprint tank for his ďnestĒ. As soon as he poops, the white part goes down through the leaves of the turf, while the black part [the smelly part] stays on top. I just remove the black part and viola, 2 minutes later, no smell. That made my mom happy.

Another issue I ran into today was his nest box and poop. I heard that they will not poop in their nest box, which was true until he went to bed last night. Then he just cut loose, which wouldnít have been a problem, except he then turned around and flopped in it [this is during the night while I was sleeping]. I woke up to my bird covered in his own fecesÖ not fun. Throughout the day he decided not to go to the edge of the box, just to poop in the boxÖ and then flop into it. So I removed the nest box and it seems to have fixed the issue, at least for the most part. I guess we will see in the morning!

On a side note, Iíve found that if I tuck a hoodís braces under the turf that is a bit too long for the box, it keeps the hood over the birds head when he lays down. Iím hoping this will get him more accustomed to the hood as well as keep it from getting muted on as much.

Iíve thoroughly enjoyed watching him grow. Yesterday I could not see his feathers at all, and this evening I can see about a cm of his wing feathers, mostly secondaryís. He looks visibly bigger as well, and felt heavier when picked up. I forgot to weigh him today; Iíll do it tomorrow if I remember. Goose was with me all day today from 5am until he went to sleep for the night, and I think we both learned a lot. So far I love the imprinting process, and I canít wait for tomorrow!



Sleeping in the morning. Notice the start of the feathers in the wing.
http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day19007.jpg


New imprint tank set up
http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day19.jpg

Video of him walking to me outside [he was hungry, but he stopped screaming when he got to me, so not 100% sure what that means.]
http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/th_day19010.jpg (http://s74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/?action=view&current=day19010.flv)

wesleyc6
05-18-2007, 07:57 AM
Noah,
Enjoyed reading that! Now you have the box like I was talking about. I should have explained it more in depth. You only cover a small part of the turf so he can lay down on something soft, but also have something bristly to walk on and poop on. I never used a nest box with mine. Just the big container. Most falcons nest on a flat cliff anyway. smile.

Can't wait to hear some updates when I get back home. I have a funeral to preach today and then I am heading out to Texas.

kimmerar
05-18-2007, 08:09 AM
Noah. Thanks for the info. Loved reading it. Boy - what a screamer. What are you feeding goose? Glad your keeping your logs on here.

Bird poop is sooo hard to get offonce it dries. I say - don't wait - hot water and dawn works well. I say - while it's wet use a rag with warm water - no dawn on the face. Good luck and please include what you find out about getting it off. Dried on hand feeding formula can be hard to get off once it dries.

Thanks again

Falcon Boy
05-18-2007, 09:31 AM
The poop on his wings has pretty much come off. His beak is getting their, its hard to do because he doesnt like his face being touched [do you blame him?]. His neck is getting a little better, but not too much. I think as time goes on its just going to flake and i can pull it off. When it was wet i tried to wipe it off but it just smeered on his down feathers [smilie=dontknow.gif]

As to what i'm feeding, I like to feed a varied diet to all my birds. So far i've fed chicks. Today i plan on incorperating some mice/rat as well and i have a shipment of quail coming in next week. If i can get my hands on duck or squirrel i will feed that too. I figure wild parents feed different items, why not do the same in a falconry situation?

I know some people don't feed chicks becuase "they aren't healthy". This is from a pamphlet i picked up in england [and it was a b*tch to type btw]

This is extracted from the Raptor Nutrition Pamplet, produced and copywrited by Neil A. Forbes and Colin G. Flint, Copyright 2000, Honeybrook Farms Animal Foods. Any spelling errors are my own and i apologize.


"Day-old chicks are often, mistakenly, considered to have the equipvalent nutritional value of a single hen's egg. This is not the case. The formation of an embryo within an egg and the development and subsequent hatching of a chick dramatically changes th echemical and nutritional value of yolk and albumen (table 3). Day-olds are used as the basis of a staple diet for a majority of species of birds of prey. Offering a high protein, low fat diet with good levels of vitamins and calcium.

In a recent study, the body composition of young Americna Kestrels (falco sparverius) fed on a diet of either day-old cockerals or mice were compared. This comprehensive study (Lavigne et al. 1994a ET 1994b) provides ample evidence as to the nutritional adequacy of day-old cockerals as a food source for American kestrels. Indeed those kestrels fed on a diet of mice showed evidence of protein deficiency with lower growth rates and slower fledging. It should be notied, however, that the lipid (fat)/protein ratios of the mice in Levigne's study vary considerably from the mice analysed in this study and by other authors (Gessaman 1987), (table 3). It may be that the mice used by Levigne were considerably older i.e. having higher fat reserves than those examined by other authors.It is essential in studying the results of analysis of any food item, to appreciate that the analysis results does relate specifically to the food which was tested, and both day olds and rodents do vary in nutritional values dependent on age, source and what they were fed on.

Cooper (1978) has discussed possible low levels of calcium in day-old chicks, yetthe figures outlined in Table 3, based on current and extensive study, give little credence to the possibilities of deficiency. The calcium levels, which are required by growing birds of prey, would be met by any of the whole prey outlined in Table 3 (Dierrenfeld et al. 1994, Robbins 1983).

Calcium levels, however, also need to be evaluated in relation to both dietary phosphorus (P) and vitatmin D3. Ca:P ratios of 1:1 - 2:1 have been reported for indeterminate egg layers (poultry) with determinate egg layers i.e. those birds which lay eggs during a specific breeding season e.g. raptors, requiring lower levels (Bird ET Ho 1976; Dierenfeld et al. 1994). Day-olds have the correct Ca: P ratio (the most important factor) as well as good overall levels of calcium. It is note worthy that Vit A, Vit E, and Ca:P ratio are all reduced by de-yolking day-old chicks and hence this once recommended technique may now be contraindicated.

The conclusion, therefore, is that day-old chicks are the ideal staple diet for most species of birds of prey, beingnutritionally sound, with high ME/GE ratios, as well as being economically priced, readily availible and convienent to use. As previously discussed, however, it woudl be most unwise to feed exclusively one type of food, therefore, consideration shuld be given to the other types of hawk food that are readily availible."

kimmerar
05-18-2007, 10:13 AM
The stuff should come off with the down. It's when those new feathers come in. You should have it figured out by then. The way you were talking made me wonder if a change of diet might have gave goose the runs a little bit (stress can help in that issue too). Sorry so blunt just a thought. It sometimes happens with baby songbirds too. Had a baby egret one time that it happened bad took me a few days to get the diet right plus it was small and was in a lake when it was found!! Day old chicks still have a lot of yolk sometimes (can cause issues for some animals was taught to use yolk for meat eating animals to help supplement but I quit that years ago - vitamins are really good now and don't cause stomach problems). I think it will be great when you get quail and mice or rats for it also.

Again - my thoughts.

I feed a variety for all birds. Brings out the best colors in song birds - again - haven't raised a baby BOP yet. You can use hand feeding formula for blue jays but nothing brings out the blue more than a variet of real insects and the weight doesn't fluctuate as much if that makes sense.

I've heard to stay away from day old chicks - maybe every once in a while. Starlings look like some very good rich meat too and my bird loves them.

Good luck and keep us informed - I need this info for when I raise a baby sharpie someday.

everetkhorton
05-18-2007, 10:52 AM
Noah: I think you are on the right track with different kinds of food. I do not feed any live birds to my Rt. I freeze them first to make sure they do not have any bug's inside them. I feed lots of starling and sqr. along with chick, and this year quail. A real mixed bag. You could most liklly put frog, snakes, etc. in also. Thanks for the information on chicks. I had heard years ago you have to watch for the down on the chick not being cast. Nothing to back up the clam.

Falcon Boy
05-18-2007, 10:57 AM
I have fed chick to RT's for 4 years, never had issues. Pellets were always cast same time each day.

Kimmerar- I have never heard before that chicks can lead to the runs [smilie=dontknow.gif] Raising eyasses is new to me so im open to ideas. I figured a varied diet would be what the wild parents provide as well as providing different levels of proteins/fats etc from each item, that way there is not an overload [hopefully].

I am still amazed at how much this guy eats. He ate almost 22 chicks yesterday. Looks like im ordering from rodent pro soon b/c he's eating me out of house and home [no complaints, better than not eating].

He's quieted down since this morning thank goodness. I am going to feed him again around 1130/1145 then take him to the pet store to pick out some mice for him and wolfgang [smilie=icon_thumright.gif]

Jimmy
05-18-2007, 01:49 PM
22 chicks in a day?????
That shows you something right there. When you get the quail he won't eat nowhere close to that much food.

Falcon Boy
05-18-2007, 02:00 PM
Honestly thats the main reason i ordered them, to decrease food comsumption as well as make a varied diet.

i started leaving food in the tank all the time as well

harrishawker1
05-18-2007, 07:42 PM
Falcon Boy,,

Thant does seen like way to many chicks and the chicks are runny from the yokes and being day olds can cause scour crop and smell bad to.
I have had 3 gyr-sakers and they are very game birds.
Anyways this is what i always feed my eyeas, no matter what kind of bop, be it hawk or falcon, Mice. chopped up mice, there serve several purposes, first off, they are 1 of the best things you can feed your bird, also if u leave some of the fur on them when u chop them up the fur will help clean the crop out from all those chicks you are feeding.
You sound like you are on the rt track and doing great.
So give some thought to nice healthy mice.
I always chop my mice up before feeding so my eyeas dont no what they are and try to hunt them in the field.
Keep up the good work

Jack
05-18-2007, 09:54 PM
Noah, eyass raptors eat more than when they get grown. My male goshawk ate one whole pigeon each and every day until he was hard pinned. My pigeons are huge homers that I have bred in giant homer for size and speed. They weigh in at well over a pound each. I didn't feed castings. I never feed my hawks or falcons castings. If they get it they do it on their own. When I do feed day DOC's I get castings regularly.
I do not worry so much about varied diet. I feed chicken necks as a staple. They have everything you would want for a raptor. I did not use them for feeding a growing eyass though. They burn off so much nutrition in growth and development that they can just eat all day long, and they need something that is a bit more nutritious.
The idea that sour crop can occur is not something to worry about. The crop on a bird is designed that he can carry off as much of a kill as he can. If a hawk is sick and can not or will not put over his crop he can suffer sour crop, but day old chicks digest so rapidly that it is not likely to happen. Healthy hawks do not suffer sour crop. When a hawk does suffer sour crop you have a more serious problem that is causing it.
I have a source of DOC's that only cost me a dime each. I can get pretty much as many as I want. I plan on going the first week of June and get 500 of them for $50. I plan on brooding several hundred up to the age of about 3 to 4 weeks of age before freezing. Grown hawks do not need the elements that a growing young hawk does. Not even close. They can get by on some pretty rough feed. As a staple diet, along with chicken necks, I can suppliment with fresh killed pigeon and some road kill. They always appreciate road kill when they can get it fresh.
My pigeons are pinned up and on wire. They are clean. No virus or infections to worry about. I can feed them immediately after killing them. The warm, fresh blood is always a treat for them. Freezing will not protect your hawk. Bacteria is usually not killed by freezing, and a virus can live for a hundred years or more, depending on the virus, and freezing will not even bother it. Frounce is a parasite protozoan. It is like a little creature rather than a virus or bacteria. It can not survive outside the host. It has to maintain a constant temperature or die. If you kill a pigeon and leave it lay for half an hour, the protozoan is usually dead by then. It is passed by mouth from adult to squab, adults as they fight, and possibly from mutes if they are consumed immediately. Pretty much all birds can get it. The reason dove and pigeon are so bad about it is because of their natural behaviors and nothing to do with what the are. Few other birds behave in the same manner that they could or would pass it on so easily. They live in colonies and they fight constantly over nesting sites and mates. When they fight they do so with their mouths. Mouth to mouth if you will. Few other birds will do that.
For what it is worth, I would never pay the high price of quail when it is absolutely not necessary. There are too many good sources of nutrition out there that is really cheap and available.

Jack

Falcon Boy
05-18-2007, 11:09 PM
Jack- I was able to get the quail for much less than retail from a friend, i wouldn't pay 1.50+ for quail, thats outragous IMO. If i wanted them that badly i'd raise them myself.

Harrishawker- I am planning on ordering some mice this weekend. In the mean time i have some rats in the fridge which are going to get whipped out tomarrow.

Falcon Boy
05-18-2007, 11:26 PM
Day 20-

6am- I awoke this morning to the sound of a screaming bird. I shot upright worried that I had over slept, just to have my brain tell me it was the local red shoulderís [later found out they were chasing my brother and sister]. My bird was standing [yes, standing, as in the first time over 3-5seconds long he has done it!!] and quiet. I snuck out of the room and started his food defrosting. When I came back he saw me and vocalized for a few minutes, then went quiet again. When his food was done I brought it up. I hooded him, and he screamed the whole time. After I unhooded him, he saw the food, but still screamed for 4-5min before actually eating. After he was done I hooded him and removed the food, and he vocalized some more. Then he went to sleep, with his head tucked behind his wing [also a first]. After about 15min he went back to sleep laying down. I left him in my room and caught a catnap with him because one brother and one sister left for school early and wouldnít be in the kitchen for him to watch.

845am- I awoke at 815am to him screaming. ďFun timesĒ, nothing I love more than a vocal bird [/sarcasm]. I brought him downstairs to watch my other 2 brothers get ready for school and I prepared his food. He screamed probably 1/3 of the time he was down there until he ate at 845. He dodged the hood twice and then took it and kept screaming. Removed the hood and let him eat, then replaced it after he was done for 2 sec while I pulled out the food bowl. I then put him in his nest box while I cleaned the imprint tank. Afterwards I added a light to one side of the tank incase he was cold, although Iím not sure if he really cares about it or not. He screamed for a while, perhaps at it, even though he had a full crop. When I stick my hand in today he screams for a few min then is quiet for a few. Right now he is attacking the hood I leave in there with him. His feathers came in a lot over night, I canít believe the difference, especially that he could actually stand today. As of now, I am going to take him to the pet store with me later to get a mouse for the snake as well as some manning for the bird. To help cease the screaming, as soon as his crop is gone I am going to offer food. At the 6am feeding I tried to leave the food in there with him, but after 15-20min he almost pooped in it, which made me remove it. He is once again being quiet now [920am]. I am hoping that it was just a morning thing from being hungry. I hope I have not inadvertently created a screamer in two days from not being 100% on par with his feeding, although he did come off the plane screaming so he could have been that way before. None the less, he is much better than he was the first day, even this morning. Quick note, I find it odd he can hate the hood, and then sleep with his head on it, under it, or beside it.

1130- Between the feedings he seemed to have a few sessions of being vocal, lasting about 5min each. They were spurred by me walking into the room, or me reaching in his imprint tank. Iíd always leave my hand in till he quieted down, the wait about 30sec, then I remove it. Markedly better at this point than this morning. I think he was just hungry this morning, and I also may have scared him when I came into the room, as he is on the opposite side of the bed as my door and looking back I came in quietly and probably scared him. I am hoping that is what the screaming was about. He has stood up and flapped his wings a few times, and boy they donít call them longwings for nothing! They are much longer than I expected at this point. His feet also seem to have grown a bit, the middle toe looks a bit longer, perhaps talon growth over foot growth? I am not sure, but I hope his feet grow as they are not very large as of now, perhaps the size of a small redtail. I still canít get over the blue on his feet and cere, I absolutely love it. I have a feeling he is going to be brown like a Saker but with Gyr colored feet and beak. Perhaps his chest will come in silver like his dad, but all his wing feathers are brown. He spent a good portion of the time between feedings awake; Iíd say at least 2/3 of the time. That is very different than yesterday, when he slept constantly unless I woke him up.

Quick note I meant to comment on before but kept forgetting. Birds dream when they sleep! I never would have believed it until I saw it, but this little guy will be fast asleep and start chirping, or flapping, or moving his legs. Pretty crazy stuff!

Had to wake him up to feed him. He vocalized like usual when I woke him up. Hood he dodged a few times and screamed the whole time. I took it off and he cropped up right away. I did not hood him afterwards b/c of how it went, Iím afraid itís leading to a negative association by hooding him after feeding. The hood Iím using is for an adult, so it is pretty big on him and he can see some. Anyone who has done this before have any advice on the hood? He went right back to sleep after eating, and Iím about to take him to the pet store.

120pm- I put food in his box while he was asleep so that he can eat right when he wakes up. We just got back from a car ride to the pet store and a few other errands. I brought him into the store and some kids looked at him and asked questions as was expected. Overall it was great socialization for him, but he got a bit chilled and started vocalizing softly. Back in the car I blasted the heat [only 54 today] until he was warm enough then ran the rest of the errands. He has been MUCH quieter than this morning; in fact his only noise was when he was cold. Right now he is sleeping in the imprint tank next to the dogs. I also put the hood I hood him with in the tank. For his last feeding tonight I might use the lure, but I might want until tomorrow when he can stand a bit better. This afternoon noise wise is a 10 fold increase on this morning. He has been silent except for when he got chilly, and then it was just little peeps.

He woke up around 130pm and ate immediately. I didnít hood him because I didnít get into the room until he was already eating, and Iím sure as hell not going to stop him from eating to hood him. Once he finished I left the food in there, and he made a few peeps. Then he went to sleep next to the hood.

Quick correction on yesterday, I said his secondaryís were the longest feathers so far, but upon him stretching his wings its actually the primaries.

4pm- Goose woke up, squeaked a bit. I hooded him and he quieted down within 2sec. 5min later he ate. He has been really good about being quiet this afternoon, when he wakes up he makes a few peeps, and when I stick my hand in he peeps a few times, then is quiet. Ahh the life of how a bird should be *smiles*.

6pm- Goose slept about half the time between 4pm and 6pm. When he was awake he was silent and didnít mind me messing with him while he was preening. Hooding went ok, still screamed and tried to dodge once. He is eating in front of both of the dogs, a German Shepard and the mini doxie without issue.

9pm- Goose was awake about half the time between feedings. He was silent until a little before he ate, when he started vocalizing a bit. Food was in his tank but I guess he was too lazy to walk to the other side to get it or he didnít know it was there because I had only fed him out of this dish once [broke the old one on accident]. Anyway I hooded him and he vocalized the whole time, upon taking the hood off he ate immediately [I moved the dish a bit closer].

I will feed him again late, around 1130pm

Reflections on the day- Today started off on a bad note, with Goose being very vocal. I think this is due to a combination of fear and hunger. I think when I brought his food back upstairs I came over the bed too fast [heís on the far side] and all of a sudden he had me looming over him. Hell if some big ugly dude was all a sudden over me Iíd be yelling too.

The afternoon/night went 100fold better. Goose was dead silent other than when he was in the pet store [he got cold, it was 54deg outside] and right before his 9pm feeding when he didnít see the food in his cage. He is usually a bit noisy, not vocal per se like hunger or fear screaming, just peeps after he eats for about 3-5minutes. Not constant, just a few squeaks every now and again, I guess he gets excited. All in all Iím happy with how today went after about 10am. I can reach into the imprint tank and touch him 80% of the time without him peeping at me, and if he does peep he stops within 30sec or so.

Developmentally he is growing at an incredible rate. His feathers came in about the same amount they did yesterday, showing a beautiful gold tip and a very dark chocolate feather. He will be a stunning bird if thatís how the rest of his feathers come in. Actually Iím biased, no matter what he looks like he will be stunning to me. Color doesnít matter anyway.

The only thing that seems to be growing slowly, if at all, is his feet. I mentioned this to a friend and his response was ďthatís the saker for youĒ. I never thought sakerís had small feet, but who knows. Anyway Iím attaching a picture of his foot in comparison to my index finger. I am surprised at how small his feet are compared to his body. When I made my lure I guess I was a bit overzealous, as it is almost as big as he is at the moment. I will have to remake it smaller.
To address the smell issue, the system I established yesterday of cleaning up the brown part of the poop immediately is working amazingly. Now the smell doesnít even have a chance to get spread. I cleaned the tank this morning, and you can just now start to get a hint of smell from it [10pm at the moment].

I ended up removing the light I had tried in the tank. He was on the other side of the tank for about 5hrs so I took the hint. Then he went back into the middle.

Most of the poop on him has flaked off. There is still someone his neck/beak/gape/feet but its coming off quicker than I thought.

Hooding is still somewhat of an issue. He just hates it near his head if itís in my hand. If I leave it on the ground he will sleep right against it, but as soon as I pick it up he vocalizes. Can someone please share their advice/experience? Perhaps I should just wait until he is hard-penned, then start hooding to avoid bad associations at this age?

I also tried the food 24/7, and noticed he didnít eat other than when I would have tossed him food anyways. So what Iíve been doing is waiting till he falls asleep after eating, and removing the food. Then Iíve been replacing the food about an hour before I would normally feed him, during which time he is sleeping. When food time arrives, I will wake him up, hood him, and viola the food is there. That way if he wants to eat before I think he does all he has to do is turn around and eat.



Goose's Foot

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day20001.jpg

Feather growth

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day20003.jpg
http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day20004.jpg

Sleeping with hoods

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day20007.jpg

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day20005.jpg

Falcon Boy
05-19-2007, 08:32 AM
Anyone got any advice on how to stop screaming for no reason? He's warm enough, has food right next to him, yet is still screaming? [smilie=bs.gif] He will scream for like 3-5min, then just stop and start preening. Yesterday he only did it in the morning, and it looks like thats how today is going to go too. Better than all day but I DO NOT want a screamer.

[smilie=BangHead.gif]


I did notice that it usually starts after a hooding session and is usually spurred by sticking my hand in his tank. Perhaps its fear of my hand after being hooded? Ideas?


**edit**

Seems to be fear causing it, as since then he has been quiet. I am going to rethink hooding this guy for now and perhaps leave it off till hardpenning.

Shortwingn
05-19-2007, 11:42 AM
Noah,
I tryed putting down some thoughts but its a hugh subject. If you want give me a call. I can put down the things I do but its going to be a few pages to touch on the subject. It will take me a while.

Falcon Boy
05-19-2007, 12:01 PM
Thanks a bunch Erik, I will give you a ring later today.

kimmerar
05-19-2007, 03:38 PM
I would to love to hear what Erik has to say if someone could do some notes on that. Noah - I'm sure you'll do that.

Love the topic.

Falcon Boy
05-19-2007, 03:56 PM
Well after a 2hr phone call, it'll be hard to type it all but i will touch on a few key points that i got from him. Erik if anything is incorrect, please correct me, and i apologize [smilie=icon_pidu.gif]

There is no such thing as too much socialization, and socialization will keep down screaming. This was the most important "take home message" if you will after talking with Erik. After talking with him, i clearly havnt been doing enough, and part of it could be boredom screaming. In fact i just had a bit of that within the past 5 min, he woke up with half a crop and started screaming. I gave him a few things to play with and he hushed. Later tonight i am going to take him to a busy petstore [not many places where I live where you can take animals]. Another way to look at it is they are stimus addicts that want to see things, and you have to keep it fun for them or they get bored. Boredom = screaming. Socializatoin also tires them out [watching everyone and everything] and a sleeping bird is not a screaming bird.

We also talked a good bit about hooding and how to fix this birds issues. I think i am going to lay off it a few days, and try again. Erik called it "resetting", or letting the bird forget about it, which doesnt always work, but sometimes does. He also said he has had a few birds that would not wear one hood if it was forced on or they have a bad memory of it, but will take other hoods perfectly. So if the reset doesnt work than i am going to whip up an anglo indian and try that. If that doesnt work, then i will try in a dark room and slowly convert to lighter and lighter situations.

Not feeding in the same place was also a big thing, as was lure association. Erik said he feeds from the lure very early on to create a food bond with the lure. He also will not feed the bird inside its box, instead, load the lure and put it in the side yard, then bring the bird out to it. Then the next feeding load the lure and put it in the front yard and let the bird go to it. Socialization while eating is an easy way to avoid carrying and mantling. Have as many people as you can walk around the bird, over the bird, etc while its eating on the lure. That way it will feel no need to mantle later in life becuase thats all it has known.

We also talked about telem and flying gyr/sakers on ground game as compared to flying other longwings on traditional quarry, what advice i should listen to as compared to what advice i shouldn't, and what i should realistically expect from this bird. Overall it was a great conversation and i learned a good bit. Once again, thanks for the time Erik, i will put your advice to use

kimmerar
05-19-2007, 08:18 PM
thanks again Erik and Noah. Can't wait to hear the results. I like the idea of hooding in the dark and moving towards lighter and lighter. Sounds like a good thing to try if hooding is an issue.

outhawkn
05-19-2007, 09:26 PM
The poop on his wings has pretty much come off. His beak is getting their, its hard to do because he doesnt like his face being touched [do you blame him?]. His neck is getting a little better, but not too much. I think as time goes on its just going to flake and i can pull it off. When it was wet i tried to wipe it off but it just smeered on his down feathers [smilie=dontknow.gif]

As to what i'm feeding, I like to feed a varied diet to all my birds. So far i've fed chicks. Today i plan on incorperating some mice/rat as well and i have a shipment of quail coming in next week. If i can get my hands on duck or squirrel i will feed that too. I figure wild parents feed different items, why not do the same in a falconry situation?

I know some people don't feed chicks becuase "they aren't healthy". This is from a pamphlet i picked up in england [and it was a b*tch to type btw]

This is extracted from the Raptor Nutrition Pamplet, produced and copywrited by Neil A. Forbes and Colin G. Flint, Copyright 2000, Honeybrook Farms Animal Foods. Any spelling errors are my own and i apologize.


"Day-old chicks are often, mistakenly, considered to have the equipvalent nutritional value of a single hen's egg. This is not the case. The formation of an embryo within an egg and the development and subsequent hatching of a chick dramatically changes th echemical and nutritional value of yolk and albumen (table 3). Day-olds are used as the basis of a staple diet for a majority of species of birds of prey. Offering a high protein, low fat diet with good levels of vitamins and calcium.

In a recent study, the body composition of young Americna Kestrels (falco sparverius) fed on a diet of either day-old cockerals or mice were compared. This comprehensive study (Lavigne et al. 1994a ET 1994b) provides ample evidence as to the nutritional adequacy of day-old cockerals as a food source for American kestrels. Indeed those kestrels fed on a diet of mice showed evidence of protein deficiency with lower growth rates and slower fledging. It should be notied, however, that the lipid (fat)/protein ratios of the mice in Levigne's study vary considerably from the mice analysed in this study and by other authors (Gessaman 1987), (table 3). It may be that the mice used by Levigne were considerably older i.e. having higher fat reserves than those examined by other authors.It is essential in studying the results of analysis of any food item, to appreciate that the analysis results does relate specifically to the food which was tested, and both day olds and rodents do vary in nutritional values dependent on age, source and what they were fed on.

Cooper (1978) has discussed possible low levels of calcium in day-old chicks, yetthe figures outlined in Table 3, based on current and extensive study, give little credence to the possibilities of deficiency. The calcium levels, which are required by growing birds of prey, would be met by any of the whole prey outlined in Table 3 (Dierrenfeld et al. 1994, Robbins 1983).

Calcium levels, however, also need to be evaluated in relation to both dietary phosphorus (P) and vitatmin D3. Ca:P ratios of 1:1 - 2:1 have been reported for indeterminate egg layers (poultry) with determinate egg layers i.e. those birds which lay eggs during a specific breeding season e.g. raptors, requiring lower levels (Bird ET Ho 1976; Dierenfeld et al. 1994). Day-olds have the correct Ca: P ratio (the most important factor) as well as good overall levels of calcium. It is note worthy that Vit A, Vit E, and Ca:P ratio are all reduced by de-yolking day-old chicks and hence this once recommended technique may now be contraindicated.

The conclusion, therefore, is that day-old chicks are the ideal staple diet for most species of birds of prey, beingnutritionally sound, with high ME/GE ratios, as well as being economically priced, readily availible and convienent to use. As previously discussed, however, it woudl be most unwise to feed exclusively one type of food, therefore, consideration shuld be given to the other types of hawk food that are readily availible."

Noah,

Nice looking bird. The study you mentioned has been under scrutiny(sp) it was done by and for Honeybrook. And they raise and sell chicks. There is some question as to just how accurate it is. Use your own judgement just wanted to you know.
You have mentioned this bird screaming. Is it still?

Nutrition,
Their are a lot of people with well meaning but mis-informed info about raptor nutrition. If you will email the Peregrine Fund,The Santa Cruz project, Cornell University, The Raptor Center, all will be happy to help you with nutrition. You can also purchase a video by Dr. Nick Fox; http://www.falcons.co.uk/default.asp?id=113
I highly recommend this video! Or you can purchase the book. " Understanding the Bird of Prey, by Nick Fox" If you really want to know what is healthy for your bird this is it.

Can raptors live on less nutritional food ,sure. Can they catch a few rabbits,sure. If you had two fighters(Boxers) and one sat on the couch and ate cheeseburgers, and the other was up running and working out and eating the right food which would be the most likely to win a fight? I would go with the guy who exercised and ate right. Same with raptors. Diet and exercise. What foods do gyrs eat, what foods do sakers eat? You want to try and feed as close to a natural diet as possible for a healthy happy raptor.


Check your PM's

Falcon Boy
05-19-2007, 10:55 PM
Bill, going to check my PM's now.




Day 21-

Goose didnít eat much at all last night.

6am- I woke up to a big surprise, Goose was still sleeping. So I snuck out of the room and got his food and put it in while he was asleep. He woke up shortly after, but did not eat, so I went back to sleep. I woke up at 730 to find 2 castings in his tank, obviously from his first two feedings on Wednesday. What a relief to know everything is in order! He was a bit vocal after that, made a little noise for about 5min, then saw the food and ate, but not very much, Iíd be surprised at 1/3 of a crop. After eating he started walking around and stretching is wings and squawking while doing it. I finally got my butt out of bed and brought his tank into the computer room so I could type up what happened, and once we were in the computer room he was silent. He has peeped a few times when I put my hand in but quiets right down within 10 seconds. Although this morning is not going as well as last night, it is by far a welcome relief over yesterday morning.

His overnight growth is amazing. I feel like I wake up looking at a new bird everyday. He is taller and fatter than yesterday, I wish I could convey it some way other than pictures as they just donít do the growth justice!

830am- Cleaned the imprint tank and noticed his crop was empty, and he was quite vocal as well. Even though the food was on the other side of the tank from him, he didnít go to it to eat. I hooded him and he screamed/dodged, etc the whole time. Hooding is a serious issue, and Iím contemplating leaving it until he is near hard penning so there is at least some chance of being able to hood him. At this rate its nothing but negative association even though heís fed right afterward. He only ate one or two bites and then stopped vocalizing and eating. Weird, Iíve never seen him not crop up before today. He has been more vocal since earlier this morning, probably because I had to move him out of the tank to clean it, so Iím hoping itís just the stress of moving rather than real screaming. I have noticed he is earlier in the morning than evening, which is kind of weird.

Quick note, still noisy at 845. I think itís a fear issue from the hood because both today and yesterday it didnít start until the hood went on poorly.

930- Ate about ĺ crop in front of the dogs on the kitchen floor

1050- Ate some more, about ĺ crop again while my little broís were playing video games [yelling and screaming]. Its defiantly fear chirping that he does because heís been silent since. When I stick my hand in he makes a little noise but quiets down after a bit. By tonight he should be completely silent again Iíd think.

1220- Goose ate a full crop of rat in front of 2bros, mom and dogs on the floor of the kitchen. He got a bit vocal while I when I reached in and then realized that there was food on the other side so he ran over there to eat. He had been hungry for about 10min [vocal] but I guess he didnít realize the food was there.

The rat is defiantly sticking in him a lot better than chicks. Itís now 3pm and he still has a partial crop. I think I have 6 rats left which make for about 1.1 feedings each, so over the next few days I should be able to give him a combination of rats and chicks until the quail arrive.

He has been absolutely silent except for a peep when I scared him once [I seem to be good at that]. He hasnít had an issue with the dogs or anything either which is good.

630pm- Goose went a really long time without eating, by far the longest yet. He is eating rat as I type this. He even tried to use his foot to rip a piece, a good sign! He used his foot one other time today to hold down an Anglo-Indian hood I let him play with. He was generally quiet, vocalized for maybe 3-5 minutes total the entire time between feedings. He ate about half a crop of food.

His feathers have come in a good bit today. They are easily double the length of yesterday. A picture of them is below. I have never seen a bird this color before, itís a very rich very dark chocolate brown. I wonder if the rest of him will turn out like this. Time will tell I suppose.

One thing that is weird is his crop seems to remain the same size, while his body increases. He seems to eat about the same amount of food.

He is now vocalizing, perhaps because he is bored. He is flapping and walking a bit around his tank. Iím taking him downstairs to go see more people, and in a few minutes Iím taking him to a BBQ where there will be a lot of people.
About the hooding, I am going to not hood him for a few days and see what happens. This is at the advice of someone who has done more than 30 imprints, so Iím going to trust their advice. If that fails, then I am going to try an Anglo-Indian hood. If that fails than I will try in the dark and slowly make it lighter. If that fails too, then I will use the strobe light method.

8pm- Went to the BBQ from 7-9pm. Right when we got there we were bombarded with people [go figure] mostly kids who wanted to touch Goose. So everyone pet his back and he did pretty well. After about 15-20min he made a few peeps then was quiet again. There were probably 100 people there, also dogs, loud music, and of course loud kids. At 8pm he ate about half a crop of rat. He fell asleep around 830 and slept with his head behind his wing, a new thing for today. He did it briefly yesterday, but not for more than 5min. Today he did it for at least 30minutes.

10pm- Cropped up again. Goose has been silent since we got back. He started screaming a little bit while I was petting him and then he decided he was hungry. If I am petting him and then he goes over to the food, is that a food association? Someone please help me on that one! He was vocal for 2-3minutes after feeding, but that has become his norm. I think he just gets excited and wants to tell the world. Now he is playing with the hood I leave in there.

Reflections on the day- Other than this morning with the hooding incident, everything went pretty well. He was silent after his fear from the hooding incident diminished. He got a good amount of socialization at the BBQ tonight and he performed great there, taking everything in stride and even eating there with music blasting and kids running around. Dogs would come up and sniff he box and he would bend over to play with his hood.

I did have him show the first signs of boredom today, which just goes to show that Erik was right about needing tons of socialization. I gave him some paper and a hood to play with and he quieted down. Tomorrow I will take him to the pet store or something so he can see people in mass quantity again. Per Erikís advice, I will also start feeding off the lure outdoors and not in his box.

As for hooding, I have decided to wait a day or two and let him calm down about it. I will judge his reaction in a few days. If he still doesnít take it well, I will try putting some food in the hood to get him to voluntarily eat out of it. If that doesnít work Iíll try a different hood, perhaps an Anglo-Indian which offers more headroom. If that fails, I will start in the dark and slowly change to lighter environments. I am pretty sure his noise in the morning is due to fear of the hood and resentment of my hands after hooding him. It usually takes him 2-3 hours to get over it. Tomorrow shall tell the tale if it is fear of the hood or if there is something else going on.

Physically Goose is growing a lot. I love watching the transformation. I go to bed and wake up with a completely different bird. Today his feathers are coming out a lot more. He also can stand for longer periods, and walk a few more steps. He is physically larger than yesterday and even started sleeping with his head behind his wing for longer periods of time. He also used his foot to hold down food and a hood today for the first time. I actually got him using his foot for the first time on video, which is below.

Gooseís eating habits today were strange. He didnít really take full crops like usual or eat nearly as much. Perhaps it has to do with casting two pellets this morning, or maybe he just wasnít as hungry. I do know the rat sticks on him longer than the chicks so that can influence it, but there were a few times where heíd walk over, pick up a piece of food, then drop it and go do something else.

I will end todayís log with a question for those with more experience. A few times I have been petting him while there is food in his tank, and while petting him he decides its food time. Is this creating a food association? If so, any ideas how to prevent it?

One last quick note, I will leave food in till I go to bed and update in the morning if he ate anything on tomorrows log.


Check out the color of the feathers
http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day21005.jpg

Size comparison
http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day21004.jpg

Flapping
http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/th_day21007.jpg (http://s74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/?action=view&current=day21007.flv)

Using foot for the first time
http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/th_day21006.jpg (http://s74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/?action=view&current=day21006.flv)

`Chris L.
05-20-2007, 08:35 AM
As for hooding, I have decided to wait a day or two and let him calm down about it. I will judge his reaction in a few days. If he still doesnít take it well, I will try putting some food in the hood to get him to voluntarily eat out of it. If that doesnít work Iíll try a different hood, perhaps an Anglo-Indian which offers more headroom. If that fails, I will start in the dark and slowly change to lighter environments. I am pretty sure his noise in the morning is due to fear of the hood and resentment of my hands after hooding him. It usually takes him 2-3 hours to get over it. Tomorrow shall tell the tale if it is fear of the hood or if there is something else going on.

Noah, I think you are making the right call on hooding. i feel he was starting to put your hand and that hood together. That would be a bad habit to break so early on in his development.

About the food behavior while petting him.. I am just throwing a guess out here so dont hold me to it, I dont think you are creating one. I think it is a social behavior you are seeing. He enjoys your company and with him wanting to eat while you are there is a good thing, its going to happen in the field the same way. As you approach and give him praise on his kill he will start to pull and break in. [smilie=dontknow.gif] just throwing my thought out there

Rats are a great source of nutrtion.Glad to see you feeding some hardier meals.

he is growing like a weed. keep us posted, great log your are keeping

Falcon Boy
05-20-2007, 10:48 AM
Thanks for the response Chris, from the people who have responded everyone seems to think it will be ok.

Here is a section of my log so far today i'd like to try and get some advice on-

This morning he has been quieter, although not silent. I have noticed a huge difference in noise type though. He has a fear chirp which can be seen in the video yesterday. He does that when he is hungry as well. When he is bored he lets out a noise that sounds like a goose, pretty ironic since I named him Goose well before I heard it. It seems like it takes him 2-3 hours in the morning to remember that people are ok. For the first feeding he fear chirped then ate and then chirped again after. It seems to be his habit, which is not good. He is silent between feedings Iíd say 80-90% of the time, but about 10minutes before he eats [even when food is available 24/7] he will start chirping and he always is a bit noisy after he eats for 2-3minutes as well. Whether this is true screaming or not I do not know, I hope someone can provide some insight?



**EDIT**

Well while talking with Aaron I think we were able to figure out the screaming. Even though he had not seen me place or remove the food, I would sit right next to him, or walk around him, stand over him while he eats. What does a parent bird do? Um, EXACTLY that. That explains the screaming issues. I hope to solve it by standing 10-15ft away while he eats from now on. Can I have my 4 days back for a re-do? *kicking myself in the ass*

Falcon Boy
05-20-2007, 11:22 PM
Sorry for double post

Day 22-

Goose didnít eat anything else last night.

7am- I woke up late just to find Goose still sleeping. Since he has been sleeping when I wake up at 6am each day I take it to mean I can sleep in a bit longer, so Iím going to start morning feedings at 7am from now on. He woke up as I placed the food in his tank, good thing I used the blocker even though he was sleeping! The blocker did however scare him I think and he screamed for 2-3min, but generally he does that every time he wakes up, and he was hungry so nothing out of the ordinary. He also cast this morning. He didnít see the food for some reason so I started touching him while he was preening. He went to do his back and then saw the food and ran over and cropped up.

After he ate we both went back to sleep. He woke up and got bored around 913am, 2 minutes before my alarm was set to go off [go figure]. He had food left but wasnít interested so Iím assuming he was bored. I put some pants on and brought him downstairs, where he soon quieted down [2-3min max].

1020am- Goose started squeaking a bit, so I loaded up the lure and brought it to the front yard. When the lure was ready I brought Goose out. I tipped his box slowly so it was on its side and he could see the food. He had been fear chirping [I think Iím slowly starting to somewhat understand the different noises he makes now] since I picked up the tank and he continued this. He didnít walk out to the lure after about 10 minutes so I gently lifted him up and put him next to it. He chirped until he saw the food then started eating. I stood up and he started chirping again, I guess he just isnít socialized enough, just goes to show I havenít been doing enough. I continued to walk around him and over him as he ate. He chirped for probably 5-7minutes without eating, then just ate it and quieted down. When he was done he started chirping again for a few minutes then he just laid down in the grass.

While I cleaned the imprint tank I had my mom watch him in the front yard. He didnít do anything except sit there and sleep. Oh yea there was a train going by less than 100yrds from where he was eating, not sure if he saw it but he defiantly heard it. Once the imprint tank was clean I gently put him back in [he screamed of course till he was back in]. At this point he isnít walking well enough to go in and out of the box readily. He can take 3-4 steps but he does it seemingly randomly.

This morning he has been quieter, although not silent. I have noticed a huge difference in noise type though. He has a fear chirp which can be seen in the video yesterday. He does that when he is hungry as well. When he is bored he lets out a noise that sounds like a goose, pretty ironic since I named him Goose well before I heard it. It seems like it takes him 2-3 hours in the morning to remember that people are ok. For the first feeding he fear chirped then ate and then chirped again after. It seems to be his habit, which is not good. He is silent between feedings Iíd say 80-90% of the time, but about 10minutes before he eats [even when food is available 24/7] he will start chirping and he always is a bit noisy after he eats for 2-3minutes as well. Whether this is true screaming or not I do not know, I hope someone can provide some insight?

1230pm- Tried to feed him outside but within the 2 minutes it took me to get him to the lure there were ants everywhere. He vocalized the whole way out and back in. Once back in I put the lure with food back in his tank. I got a clip of his scream example. In the clip I touched him to get him to do the noise, but his scream the rest of the time is the same. Is this food begging or is this fear screaming? Ate partial crop.

Note-Well while talking with Aaron I think we were able to figure out the screaming. Even though he had not seen me place or remove the food, I would sit right next to him, or walk around him, stand over him while he eats. What does a parent bird do? Um, EXACTLY that. That explains the screaming issues. I hope to solve it by standing 10-15ft away while he eats from now on. Can I have my 4 days back for a re-do? *kicking myself in the ass*

245pm- YES YES YES! We finally did something right! WAHOO! While Goose was sleeping I stick a plate of rat in there [the lure was covered with ants from outside earlier]. He woke up, made two small peeps, then he started eating. Finally something went to plan! My brothers are about 5ft from him; I'm about 10ft from him. After eating he made his usual 2-3 minutes [not constant, just vocalization here and there], stretched his wings, and sat down. Everything went to plan, I am stoked!

430pm- Another textbook feeding! I put the food in while Goose was sleeping. He woke up just kind of laid there for a bit. Then he got up and ate, without a single peep. Damnit he just pooped on the left over food. Anyway he didnít make a single peep after eating either. This is how itís supposed to be!

530pm- Goose started screaming, I thought he was bored, so I tossed him a few things to play with, a lure [not his] and a piece of scrap leather. He played for a bit then went over and ate 1/3 crop of rat. Goose was silent afterwards.

745pm- Goose cropped up. He didnít issue a peep before eating. During the time between feedings, he spent a lot of the time awake. He did get bored for a bit but I tossed him a piece of paper and he played with it for bit then laid back down. After eating he let out one high pitch squeak then was silent. I can already see an improvement in noise volume from standing further away while he eats. I think we are finally getting on the right track, although I have not been feeding him outside because my yard seems to be infested with ants no matter where I go. I tried 2-3 different spots today [side, front yards] and every time I brought Goose out there were ants all over the lure.

1130pm- Goose cropped up. One small vocalization before eating, none after.

Reflections on the day- All I can stay is wow. We went from bad behavior to text book good behavior in a matter of hours. What else can I ask for?

This morning he was a rowdy little guy, less than normal screaming but still a bit vocal. I spoke with Aaron around mid-day about screaming and we figured out I was standing too close and hovering over the bird, creating a parent-like bond which was increasing the screaming around food times. The proposed solution was to stand 8-10 feet away while Goose eats. That way I am around, but not hovering over like a parent bird would. Within a few feedings, Goose made no noise before his meal [feeding before final feeding] and was down to one tiny squeak after his meal, and that was just because I came to sit down. Between meals he was very good, especially at the end of the day. All I can say is his behavior this afternoon/evening was nothing short of fantastic, especially compared to other days.

I had intended to take him to a pet store today to sit outside and watch the dogs/cars/people pass by, but it ended up raining so that was a no-go. He was however in the mix of things when my brothers decided to yell and scream at the TV playing videogames. He slept right through it, and when he woke up he ate.

Growth wise his head looks bigger today, that was the first thing I noticed when I woke up. He has been walking around and flapping his wings quite regularly. His feathers came out more but not as much as yesterday. Other than that, there not much else to note.


http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day22002.jpg

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day22003.jpg

Falcon Boy
05-21-2007, 11:15 PM
Day 23-

8am- Goose ate this morning. No vocalizations before, but he did fear chirp as I moved his tank down into the kitchen. I was scrambling to get ready to work so I left him enough food till I got home. While I was gone he was left in front of the TV.

2pm- Goose has no crop but isnít hungry. I just cleaned his imprint tank. When I got home he screamed for a few minutes upon seeing me but calmed down within 2-3 minutes. He fussed as usual during the transfer out of his tank when I had to clean it. About a crop or two size portion is missing from the food bowl so he did eat sometime while I was gone. Other than that he seems no worse for the wear, no more vocal than any other morning, in fact a bit less than yesterday even.

His feathers are really starting to come in now. He is starting to get the V down his back. His tail feathers all look like little paintbrushes, no real feather out yet but you can see it is just starting to come in. He has a row or two above his tail coming in at along the same pace. He is using his feet more and more everyday and his body is really getting big.

Equipment wise, I plan on putting anklets on him within the next week. I am going to run up to Frederick to borrow my friendís grommet pliers as mine met a fate with a train after screwing up too often. I should probably invest in a new pair but my friend will let me use his. Hood wise, I am getting a size 7 as well as size 8. That will leave me with hoods sized 6.5,7,8, and 8.5. If he ends up wearing a 7.5 Iíll be a little peeved but that is life and Iím half expecting him to need a 7.5 because I have luck like that. Worst case it adds to my hood collection which is getting quite large [Iím not complaining].

745pm- I just got back from 2-3 hours out with Goose. We went to the local Petsmart and walked around for a bit. I would put him on the ground as people asked questions, touched him, etc. He did pretty well, vocalized a bit but hushed. After about an hour and a half I took him out front where we watched the cars pass and more people gathered around to talk. I must have said ďheís a falcon not a chickenĒ at least 25 timesÖ that gets old quick. Either way it was a great experience with him eating small bits 2-3 times during the time we were there. I also spent about an hour outside with him and the dogs before I left just around the yard. He was quite vocal today, but I think it was mainly fear as we did a lot of things he isnít used to.

8pm- Cropped up without making a peep before or after the feeding. Didnít even peep when I carried his imprint tank upstairs [he ALWAYS has peeped when I carry the tank around]. Looks like we may still be on the right track.

11pm- Goose just cropped up about Ĺ-3/4 crop. He has been silent until now, but he just waged a war with the Astroturf, footing, biting, screaming, and flapping at it. At this point it looks like the turf won, but it was fun to watch! Heís finally getting some power in those feet.

Reflections on the day- Being that I was at work most of the morning, I canít comment too much on that. I do know when I came home he was vocal as he usually is in the morning, but really no worse for the wear.

We did have a few adventures today. We spent about an hour outside. He screamed for the first half an hour every time a bug moved but he calmed down and was fine with the dogs coming up and sniffing him. He did pretty well at Petsmart for the 2-3 hours we were there, not vocalizing much and eating in front of large groups of people, dogs, and cars going by less than 10feet away. All in all, it was a pretty good day of socialization.

Growth wise he is getting very large. He is also starting to use his feet, and as mentioned earlier got in a fight with the Astroturf. It was funny to watch him foot the ground, stomp, and bite it. His feathers are really growing and probably close to half an inch now.

In the end, I view today as another good day down on record. He was pretty good when I got back from being gone, and I donít think he has been food begging. I think his screaming has been from fear [entering room, new people, cars, etc]. I think we are on the right track so far.


http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day23003.jpg

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day23004.jpg

`Chris L.
05-22-2007, 08:34 AM
I must have said ďheís a falcon not a chickenĒ at least 25 timesÖ that gets old quick.

[smilie=BangHead.gif] .. that is great.

Falcon Boy
05-22-2007, 11:35 PM
Day 24-

915am- Goose was quiet this morning so I went a bit longer until his feeding. Once I moved his tank he started screaming like a banshee even though he had food in front of him. Once moved it took about 2-3 minutes for him to start eating. He ate about 1/2crop then started screaming and fighting the floor. It is really funny to watch him foot and bite the floor. I think all his dreaming and such during the night makes him vocal in the morning as it seems to be like this every day. I donít think it is a food beg because he isnít looking at me or anything, he just looks around and screams. He is also stand up, stretching, flapping, and biting the floor this morning, heís very animated.

Goose was vocal on and off for about an hour after feeding. Nothing really in particular I can think of, I am thinking it was boredom screaming because after about 1/2hr I tossed in a piece of paper and that old hood I made and he hushed up.

1145am- Ate about half crop. Was silent before, made a few noises after while he ran about and flapped. He stood for almost a minute strait, heís getting better! I am not sure why he is so vocal today; Iím hoping itís a fluke thing. There is a video I took right after this feeding I will post.

Went to lunch with my dad so Goose was home alone from about 12-1pm. He was no worse for the wear when I got home. I left him in the computer room with a random mix of music on.

I worked from 5-10pm. Before I left he was silent and ate small bits of food. Apparently while I was gone he ate around 645pm and then he scarfed down another crop full at 1030pm when I got home. He was loud after eating for about 5-10minutes flapping and stomping up a storm. Then he quieted down and just preened for about 45minutes. I expect he will stay awake for another 15-20 minutes then go to sleep for the night.

Reflections on the day- Today wasÖ interesting. I didnít really learn too much but rather had to scratch my head and think. The bird is always rowdy in the morning it seems, that much Iíve figured out. He also tends to be noisy after eating, I guess he gets excited and he normally romps around for a good 5-10 minutes screaming on and off flapping and walking.

Goose is really getting big. His V on his back is very defined now and feathers keep on growing. Iím really tired and there isnít much else to note, so Iím done for the day.



http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day24003.jpg

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day24004.jpg

Falcon Boy
05-23-2007, 10:52 PM
Day 25-

7am- I woke up at 7am this morning and Goose was awake. When he saw I was up he started screaming. I assumed it was because of food, so I got it ready. I snuck it into his nest box by putting a little wood dowel in there for play with at the same time while having a rag cover the food dish. I put the dowel on his other side and while he footed that, I slipped the rag off the food, and viola both items were in his nest bowl. He kept screaming though and did not eat, so I am assuming it was boredom screaming. So I put another old Arab hood in there for him to play with or tear apart, as well as brought him downstairs to where 2 of my brothers were getting ready to for school. As of 8am he was quiet and still had not eaten.

1130am- Just had Goose out back for the past hour and a half while I cleaned his tank and then we just laid around for a bit with the dogs. Goose still screams at the dog a bit but not as much as he used to. He is getting better around him. He doesnít mind unless the dog comes right up to him and sniffs him. Goose was vocal the first 15-20min or so doing his ďgooseĒ sounding voice. I finally looked up [where he had been looking the whole time] and saw our local hag female red-shoulder kiting right above us. I yelled a bit and she drifted about 100 yards away. Pretty gutsy to do that when I was 15ft from Goose! The RS was about 200-300ft up. Once she drifted off Goose was quiet except for a few peeps at the dog and any vultures that came over. He is a hoot outdoors, he walks around in the grass stalking leaves, and when the wind blows them to him he grabs them in his mouth.

1-230pm Goose was home alone in front of the TV while I ran to the gym.

Goose was silent when I got home and stayed that way. I jumped in the car and ran up to Chrisís place, it was time for Gooseís anklets. After a lot of screaming and a little finagling, I got his anklets on, and he didnít resent me for it. When I got home he laid in the front yard for a good hour or hour and a half while the kids and their friends washed the cars.

Goose has been generally quiet today, which is good. We spent a good amount of time outdoors, and Goose got some quail into his system. He probably watched 4-5 trains go by 20 yards away through the trees, didnít even look after the first time.

1045pm- Goose has been eating about ľ of a crop on and off throughout the night. He has also been completely silent since I got home and brought him insideÖ itís been great to say the least!

Reflections on the day- Last night I decided to reintroduce the nest box. He ended up not pooping in it, which was nice. He tends to jump out of it though [well more like face-plant] but he canít get back into itÖ but he seems comfortable. Tonight I will leave food in overnight and see if it makes a difference noise wise, that way he can eat right when he gets up instead of waiting for me.

Today went pretty well. He got his anklets on, which he most certainly didnít like, but he got over it very quickly. We spent a good portion of time today outdoors outside the nest box. He would jump out of his little nest and lie around in the grass and sometimes walk after bugs. He also ate and then later slept outdoors in front of about 10 kids running around washing a car [unfortunately not mineÖ].

Goose is really getting quite large, as you can see in todayís pictures. His feathers look to be coming in as a dark Saker and they are still growing at an incredible rate. His feet are finally getting some strength which Chris found out, although they are not terribly strong yet. The blue color is becoming really apparent in his feet, I love it.

Overall it was a good day, and there isnít really anything else to note other than the car ride was a total of about 1.5-2 hours to and from Chrisís house.



oO a camera
http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day25006.jpg

Come here fly...
http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day25005.jpg

Feather growth

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day25002.jpg

With the dog
http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day25004.jpg

Goose and I [he even smiled ;)]

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day25008.jpg

wesleyc6
05-23-2007, 11:15 PM
Good job Noah. Hang in there! Sounds like things are starting to go right now. He looks like he is really growing. I was thinking back to when I told you my falcon was quiet. That isn't completely true. He was quiet when he feathered out. He screamed like a banshee when he was "killin" his toys as a pre hard penned falcon. LOL. Anything red or fuzzy he would scream and foot. I always wondered if one of the kids whacked him with something red like a ball. He also seemed a little frustrated if he couldn't be mobile when he wanted to. If you bird is walking some, then it probably is time to make his "box" larger. Food screaming tends to be loud and continuous from the birds I have seen that screamed. I wouldn't take any chances with food though and he would always have it. What could it hurt? If it is food, then not having it could really louse things up for ya. Once he was on the block though, he was almost 100% silent. He did make sweet sounds occaisionally, but they were soft. I know you hear lots of stuff, but two things I think almost all people agree on is to avoid hunger and to socialize(w/0 scaring the mess out of him) Don't let his legs flail and scoop him out to sit in your lap and all. Socializing an imprint is different than socializing a passage if you know what I mean. Just some thoughts.

Falcons can really scream when they are mad. Nolan and Ozzie both did and one was an imprint and one was a hacked bird. Neither did I raise, but if they got mad, they let you know.

Ozzie was a gyr/prairie and he sounded like a goose too.

Falcon Boy
05-24-2007, 09:57 AM
\ I was thinking back to when I told you my falcon was quiet. That isn't completely true.

LOL i seem to have a lot of people telling me that now after i flipped out a few days in a row [smilie=icon_thumright.gif]

This morning he has been standing and walking almost all morning, looks like its time for the kiddie pool! I'll pick one up today if i can find a store with one [walmart here i come...]

Thanks for the kudos, much appreciated. Things are starting to look up, he hasnt even pulled on his anklets so at this point i'll keep doing what seems to be working and we should be hard penned in no time [smilie=banana.gif]

wesleyc6
05-24-2007, 10:53 AM
Yeah, silent is mostly the result and not the journey, but of course, things learned on the journey can be trouble in the result. My bird made little noise, and never a noise everyday at the same time. That is the only thing that worries me about Goose a little, but you also have to know what the breeder did too.

Falcon Boy
05-24-2007, 11:02 PM
Day 26-

930am- Well my alarm didnít go off, I guess the power burped last night. Goose was silent until he noticed I was awake, and then he started screaming a bit. After about 10 minutes and he had some food in him he quiet down.

Around 10-1015am I took him outdoors and we were outside for about half hour while I cleaned his tank. I would have stayed out longer but I had to drive my brother to school. This morning I noticed Goose was standing and walking everywhere instead of sitting, so I picked up a kiddy pool as his new housing arrangement. I will put his nest in the middle and he will have the rest to walk around in. He was vocal for about a minute when I first got back home, but after that he quieted down and ate about 10 minutes later.

This afternoon Goose was very good, very quiet, didnít make a peep of sound. I forgot to record a majority of the day. Bummer.

Reflections on the day- Goose seemed much more comfortable in his kiddy pool than he did in the box. He got up and flapped around stretching his wings and legs and such. I also like that he is right in the mix of things downstairs while in it without the plastic walls. He was silent after this morning short of a random scream or two if something scared him. Overall screaming seems greatly improved. His feathers are really starting to come in as well as his tail feathers which now have about a cm of brown feather coming out. He also stood a lot today, at least 3x as much as the past few days.



http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day26002.jpg

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day26004.jpg

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day26006.jpg

Shortwingn
05-25-2007, 10:07 AM
Hi Noah,
One other thing I do is keep a small spray bottle(the kind for plant misting). When its hot it is good relife and keeps the mess off the bird. I give them a spray down when nessary. Helps get the pin caseing soft for eaiser preening as well.

Falcon Boy
05-25-2007, 10:21 AM
I will do that from now on, thanks for the tip!

everetkhorton
05-25-2007, 12:36 PM
Noah: 9:30 Did you party all night ? [smilie=icon_pidu.gif]

Falcon Boy
05-25-2007, 01:09 PM
The power blurped over night, woke up to my alarm clock blinking 3:30 LOL

chamokane
05-25-2007, 03:55 PM
Hi Noah,
One other thing I do is keep a small spray bottle(the kind for plant misting). When its hot it is good relife and keeps the mess off the bird. I give them a spray down when nessary. Helps get the pin caseing soft for eaiser preening as well.

I'll second the spray bottle suggestion. It's good to get the bird used to it while he is small. Then, anytime he gets hot, while traveling or anytime, you can just spray him down. You can spray some water into his mouth to give him a drink too. Keeping a bird well hydrated can do wonders for his attitude. A lot of birds will learn to reach out toward the bottle with their beaks if they are thirsty. When my Peregrine sees me coming with the spray bottle, she hops down off the perch and comes toward me as far as her leash will allow and she starts ducking her tail as if she were taking a bath. When she feels like she is wet enough, she hops back up on her perch. A good soaking can calm a bird down if it gets worked up over something too.

When you introduce the spray bottle, I'd stand back and just lightly mist him a couple of times so you don't scare him with it. Some birds love the spray right away and some need to get used to it more gradually.

I think that a spray bottle should be thought of as an important piece of falconry gear.

Falcon Boy
05-25-2007, 11:00 PM
Day 27-

831am- Woke up to find Goose preening, and he started vocalizing when he realized I was awake. I got his food ready and put it in his kiddy pool, then put him in. He ate after about 2 minutes and then vocalized for about 15 minutes. He seems cranky this morning, not sure why.

1pm- Had Goose out front for about an hour and a half laying about 15ft from the dogs. He didnít mind the cars 40yards away and didnít mind the dogs, just kind of hung out. I sprayed some water over his head while cleaning his tank so heíd get a little wet and start preening. I brought him inside about 1pm and he got vocal like he usually does when I move his nest [he doesnít like the whole world moving without the legs moving thing] and about 105pm he ate a fair bit of fresh quail. After that he was quiet, preened a tad, and went to sleep.

1030pm- WHAT A DAY weíve had. Around 2pm we went to a fellow falconerís house until around 4pm. He did pretty well after the first 2-3minutes, he just fell asleep. Once I got back I had to go straight to work. Goose was left in the middle room where he could see the family in the kitchen/living room and running up and down the stairs.

I got home to a bird screaming at me as soon as I opened the door. He had eaten all his quail I left him [about 2 crops, it was a whole quail] and was hungry again. I quickly defrosted some food and gave it to him. He DEFINATLY knows what the paper plate blocker means. I am not sure if he knows I supply the food behind the blocker, but he knows when that blocker comes out food will be appearing. Not sure what to do about that other than to change blockers [again]. If he knows I provide food [which could be the case even though heís never seen me feed him] I am thinking about having someone else feed him, thus creating a food bond with them. That way when I move I will have a silent bird because he will never see them again. Any thoughts?

Reflections on the day- Well, today was pretty much crap. Lots of screaming, interrupted by moments of goodness. I think Goose knows I provide the food, which has created a scream every time I walk by and he is a bit hungry. Itís annoying to say the least. I am not sure how he figured it out since I always use a blocker. I guess itís the Gyrís intelligence coming into play, or someone else is feeding him while Iím at work [although I really doubt it by how his food bowl was empty]. Anyone have an opinion on having someone else feed him so that he creates a food bond with them? It will create short term screaming, but if he screams at them only, he wonít be screaming once I move because they will be half a continent away. Whatís your allís opinions?

Growth wise, he stood a lot today, and I finally got a picture of it this evening. His feet are getting BIG, so much for the worry about them! Feathers keep getting longer, as per usual.



size comparison for old pics, this is him now in same nest box
http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day27008.jpg

Standing and hungry!
http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day27007.jpg

Feathers
http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day27003.jpg

Shortwingn
05-26-2007, 07:30 AM
I got home to a bird screaming at me as soon as I opened the door. He had eaten all his quail I left him [about 2 crops, it was a whole quail] and was hungry again.

Sounds like there might be a food association going on. Try leaving more food.

I quickly defrosted some food and gave it to him. He DEFINATLY knows what the paper plate blocker means. I am not sure if he knows I supply the food behind the blocker, but he knows when that blocker comes out food will be appearing. Not sure what to do about that other than to change blockers [again].

This is why I feed the imprint from the lure. Right from day one they know what the lure means.... something to eat. If they make a food association with it so what? Later in life I stop garnishing the lure, have them come to the lure and call them up to the fist.

If he knows I provide food [which could be the case even though heís never seen me feed him] I am thinking about having someone else feed him, thus creating a food bond with them. That way when I move I will have a silent bird because he will never see them again. Any thoughts?

This works wonders if you can find a mindful and willing falconer. Its also kind of a cop out. Just learn how to work through it. With each imprint you will get better. In a few years you will be able to turn out a no screaming, no footing, no mantling, game catching monster.

Reflections on the day- Well, today was pretty much crap. Lots of screaming, interrupted by moments of goodness. I think Goose knows I provide the food,

Yes, they all know. One reason I bring the imprint to the food. They know I bring them to food and later bring them to game.

which has created a scream every time I walk by and he is a bit hungry. Itís annoying to say the least.

Pack more food into him. Its a good time to make him run to the lure.

I am not sure how he figured it out since I always use a blocker. I guess itís the Gyrís intelligence coming into play, or someone else is feeding him while Iím at work [although I really doubt it by how his food bowl was empty].

A bit of a touchie subject. Let me just say I have been screwed by family and girl friends in the past. So have a few apprentices. Keep a sharp eye out and dont over react when you catch them. LoL

Anyone have an opinion on having someone else feed him so that he creates a food bond with them? It will create short term screaming, but if he screams at them only, he wonít be screaming once I move because they will be half a continent away. Whatís your allís opinions?

Why would you buy a corvette and have a friend drive it? Maybe if you both got one and traded back and fourth? But would you trust your friend not to eat and smoke in yours. Must be a good friend.

I dont think I have ever raised two imprints exactly alike. They just dont all seem to fit into one cookie cutter. Adjust your game plan as nessary. Just dont lose track of the final destination.

Shortwingn
05-26-2007, 07:32 AM
How do you do that neat box thing anyhow?

Falcon Boy
05-26-2007, 12:11 PM
Erik,
Good points made, thanks for the post. I dont understand the nest box question though? I dont understand what you're asking. [smilie=dontknow.gif]

I will start bringing him to the food as much as my work schedule allows now, and i'll start to feed off the lure again [still searching for a big area without ants....]

Falcon Boy
05-26-2007, 10:34 PM
Day 28-

4pm- It has been a really good day so far. Goose has been silent a majority of the day, including most of the hour and a half or two hours we were outside. He is standing more and more today. He also ate two of his meals off the lure [will try and do that from now on]. Figures right as I finish saying he has been quiet he wakes up and starts screaming, go figure.

Goose was vocal on and off for about half an hour. I took him outside and carried him around for about 45min-1hr while my step-dad was mowing. I carried around his nest box with him sitting in it for the record [I know someone would say they donít like to be handled].

10pm- Goose ate a full crop around 930pm. Eating today was weird, he didnít eat huge meals, just little bits less than usual in frequency and then had one big crop tonight. Today he ate 2 quail, the back of a squirrel, part of a rat, and a few chicks. Not bad for a little guy!

Reflections on the day- Goose can really down some food. Although he didnít eat as big of meals as frequently as yesterday, he still went through the food mentioned above. Looks like I should start raising quail if I can pull the funds together for it, because at this rate I will be out of food in a few weeks.

Goose started standing a lot today and walking around a lot better. Today I saw him stand for up to 10 minutes straight. Looks like itís almost time to stand on the fist, heís just got to get more comfortable on the ground first. I think I am going to wait until he stands all the time instead of sitting for that though.

In terms of vocalizations, today was 10 times better than yesterday but still not perfect. Definitely a marked improvement though. Yesterday must have just been a combo of boredom/hunger/fear.

Socialization wise, I walked him around in his nest box today around the yard, near the lawn mower while my step-dad was mowing, near the road, and near the train tracks and dogs. Nothing seemed to bug him too much. Heíd look for half a second then go back to looking around.

He also ate most his meals off the lure


http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day28004.jpg

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day28001.jpg

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day28003.jpg

wesleyc6
05-26-2007, 10:44 PM
Wow, Goose's head is a lot different than my bird's head is. He is packing away a lot of food too!!!! Mine ate a couple of rats yesterday, but one was really small and one was medium. He ate some quail too. I processed 6 quail at one time and he hasn't eaten them all yet. Utah is walking around a pretty good bit too.

Falcon Boy
05-27-2007, 08:49 PM
Day 29-

130pm- I had to work from 7-1pm today but I left him a huge plate of food, of which half was gone. I left him in the main room of the house as usual in his kiddy pool so he could see lots of people walk by. We had a family get together with at least 30 people + 30 screaming kids in attendance so I brought Goose outside where most of the people were and put his nest box on the ground. He immediately jumped out and started running and hopping towards people kakking! It was really funny, heíd run to one person flapping and hopping [first time for that btw] and then kak at them. Then heíd run to another person and kak. Then heíd run over to me and lay down on my foot. He was quite funny and didnít really mind the people or dogs at all.

He was cooperative throughout the night, gobbling down food like a fiend as his usual and uttering the occasional kak. Around 630pm I brought his nest box upstairs and sat it on my lap while I was on the computer and playing video games. He didnít mind at all, and fell asleep with his head against my chest.

One thing that kind of worries me is he has been breathing with his mouth open a bit today/yesterday. Most times it is after one of his running/flapping fests but it still makes me paranoid of asper. His pool is cleaned daily so I donít see how there could be mold in it though. Probably just from him flapping around and getting hot. I will keep an eye on it though just in case. Probably just another case of me being paranoid *G*.

All in all, a good day with good socialization, very little screaming, and no food begging.

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day29002.jpg

Falcon Boy
05-27-2007, 08:52 PM
Wow, Goose's head is a lot different than my bird's head is. He is packing away a lot of food too!!!! Mine ate a couple of rats yesterday, but one was really small and one was medium. He ate some quail too. I processed 6 quail at one time and he hasn't eaten them all yet. Utah is walking around a pretty good bit too.

Utah's head reminds me of a kbird's in general shape, very rounded as compared to goose's somewhat triangular shape

Jack
05-27-2007, 10:20 PM
When young falcons scream it in not always about food. If you continue to feed him in individual meals you will see him screaming and acting silly when he gets hungry and thinks you are about to feed him. The screaming when he is full is mostly due to fear of something, or resentment of it. Dog, something noisy, yourself when he first sees you for the day. They do not like being carried as young birds, and they like familiar surroundings until they fledge. They do not always outwardly show their concern of certain things, but they will scream.
I have a 5 year old gyr/prairie tiercel. He was raised in a tank I think, and fed individual meals. He was so terrible the owner gave him away. He was so terrible that new owner gave him to me. I have had him for 2 years now. He is ok as a hunting bird, but it is very difficult for me to tolerate his behavior at times. I can not feed him on my fist. Won't happen. As soon as I give him anything at all he tries to dive off the fist and will hang upside down and scream until my nose bleeds. I can reach for him in an effort to put him back on the glove and he will foot me really bad. And if I do manage to get him on the fist he just dives off again. He will hang there and scream for hours. I can give him the lure or a piece of meat and he would try to fly off with it. He never stopped screaming. Even with a full crop he did that. I have spent the entire last 2 years in an effort to stop this behavior. I have achieved success in being able to feed him on the fist, and I can stand over him on the lure now, but he still screams in anticipation of food. Still when I am about to slip him I have to wrestle the hood off of him. He hoods well, but when the hood braces are struck he will start screaming and fighting me, wanting the hood off and yet I have to chase him about on my fist. I am hoping to eventually get this out of him, but I am not sure it will happen. I know how it got started though, and he did not have to turn out that way. I can not give this bird away. And if I could, he would be dead inside a year I think. Someone would ring his neck. I have worked him out of most of his real nasty habits, but with a new falconer he would go right back to the way he was when I got him.

Jack

Falcon Boy
05-27-2007, 10:43 PM
i have been leaving food 24/7, but a few times i did not leave enough while i went to work. I think i got it down now though [resorted to leaving enough to feed a small army].

Sounds like you got your hands full with that gyr/prairie. What weight does he fly at? I've never heard a weight off one of them.

`Chris L.
05-28-2007, 09:12 AM
I know how it got started though, and he did not have to turn out that way..

Jack

Jack, What do you think caused this behavior in him? Great post and thank you for sharing that.

everetkhorton
05-28-2007, 02:54 PM
Jack: I had a hand me down prairie falcon. What a mistake, it was my first falcon. If you EVER take a hand me down bird, do a lot of talking to the owner and find out how he did things. Feeding, flying, hunting. manning any thing and every thing. JMO

Jack
05-28-2007, 09:48 PM
Chris and EV. Chase, my gyr/prairie tiercel came to me with all sorts of problems, but I knew about them going in. It took bringing him down to about 560 grams, or around 20 ounces just to get him to sit on my fist. I had him perched on a block right next to me in the den all the time. I carried him around and placed him on perches everywhere I went. I tried to get him to feed from my fist as a way of making a peace treaty with him, but he just got worse when food was present. I have spent 2 whole years working on him. Today he will fly at 680 grams, or around 24 ounces. That is a full 4 ounces and he never bates away from me now. Like today. He has to weight at least 26 ounces right now, but when I go into the mews to feed him, rather than bate off the walls trying to get as far away from me as he could, He just comes right to me and takes the food right out of my hand without a problem. Just being consistant is what it takes. And you have to figure out what causes a problem before you can solve it.
Here is what caused his problems. The guy did not want the bird associating him with food at all, so he never stayed in the same room when the bird was fed. And he fed him individual meals. The bird would take a heavy crop when he did eat, and if you showed up while he ate he would start screaming and try to get away with it. You had best not even think of sticking a hand near or he would leave the food and fight the hand by grabbing it and biting. He Would then resent the presents of the falconer once fed and would scream to vent his rage. He would bate away because he did not want to be touched. Feeding had become a private and personal thing. He eventually learned where food comes from and when he started to get hungry he would become vocal, but would still resent his presents because it was a time associated with feeding. The boy created a monster just as if he intended to do so. When the second guy got him, he had absolutely no idea about what could have been wrong. He talked to the original owner, but did not ask the right questions. The first guy had flown him at about 25 ounces, which was a bit too high in the first place. So I knew he would fly around 24 ounces if I could just get him past the seeming hatred he had for me. The second guy brought him down to 22 ounces and he would just fly off. He spent way too much time tracking him down. Then he gave up and gave him to me. He was talking about putting him down, but I took him. I fought the little fool unitl I decided that if I killed him it would be no great loss. So I started cutting him on down until he had a complete attitude change. I flew him that way for a season and he still did not do well. Then he became too weak to really fly well at all. He sat more than anything else. Once he crashed I started bringing him back up slowly. He had become like a kitten by that time. I slowly brought him on up and flew him as he came up. The weight gain did not seem to make much difference in his behavior until he hit the 24 ounce mark. He does not bate away from me at this weight, and at feeding time, or hunting time, he actually bates toward me. He does not scream like he did. But he still is vocal when I try to take the hood off. I have to wrestle him around to strike the braces unless I do it before I pick him up. I get so aggrevated I sometimes want to must pull the hood off without striking the braces. Once off he shuts up and flys. He flys really high too. He still has problems, but I am slowly ironing them out. I am hoping that eventually he will make me a pretty decent duck hawk. I have only manage 7 ducks over a 2 year period with him, but next season I fully expect a really good season.

Jack

`Chris L.
05-28-2007, 09:56 PM
Jack,
great post, Man he was a mess when you received him for sure. How does he do during the molt.. does he revert back when his weight is high right now? Or have you noticed some improvements even at a higher weight?

Falcon Boy
05-28-2007, 10:21 PM
Day 30-

Not a whole lot to note today as I forgot to record the log as the day went on. This morning he was only vocal for about 2-3 minutes in the morning, and it was not constant. Definite improvement in that area! Throughout the day he was vocal on and off, mostly when he got bored. No food screaming what-so-ever because food was available 24/7 and he did not have an empty dish at any point.

His feeding was odd today; he took a few meals off the lure and a few off the dish. He ate around 815am and then not again until 3pm. Then he took a full crop, and also topped it off at 4pm and 5pm. In that time though he once again really shoveled down some food. Tomorrow Iíll try and get a weight on him if I remember, heís getting huge!

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day30005.jpg

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day30006.jpg

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day30011.jpg

Goose playing battlefield 2, staring down the map trying to pick a sniper spot ;)

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/th_day30017.jpg (http://s74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/?action=view&current=day30017.flv)

`Chris L.
05-29-2007, 08:48 AM
Noah,
he is growing quick!!!. I loved the video of him watching the game.. he looked intense.. lol.

Falcon Boy
05-29-2007, 10:11 AM
Noah,
he is growing quick!!!. I loved the video of him watching the game.. he looked intense.. lol.

You shoulda seen him once it booted up, i'd fly the helo and everytime i'd pass a plane or another helo he'd scream LOL. I'll try and get it on video tonight if i play [which i probably will... bf2 is arguably the best game ever [smilie=icon_thumright.gif] ]

outhawkn
05-29-2007, 01:52 PM
BTW Noah, I got to tell you. This diary your doing. Is a gutsy thing to do. As many birds as I have imprinted in my life, I would not put it out there for everyone to see. So no matter how the imprint job turns out( and I hope well) you have earned my respect!
Bill

Falcon Boy
05-29-2007, 01:57 PM
BTW Noah, I got to tell you. This diary your doing. Is a gutsy thing to do. As many birds as I have imprinted in my life, I would not put it out there for everyone to see. So no matter how the imprint job turns out( and I hope well) you have earned my respect!
Bill

Bill,
Thanks. I have not been able to find anywhere really logs of how people have imprinted birds, so i figure even though im inexperianced i'd put one out there. It also gives me a place to look back for my next imprint, see what went right, where i went wrong, and what i can do to fix it. Not to mention it allows for me to get feedback from folks who have done it and notice potential issues. I'm hoping for the best, right now he is behaving perfectly [aka silent!] but we shall see in a few weeks [smilie=banana.gif]

Thanks everyone once again for your help along the way, it's surely saved me at least a few headaches.

`Chris L.
05-29-2007, 08:21 PM
BTW Noah, I got to tell you. This diary your doing. Is a gutsy thing to do. As many birds as I have imprinted in my life, I would not put it out there for everyone to see. So no matter how the imprint job turns out( and I hope well) you have earned my respect!
Bill

I agree you are putting yourself out there, and I respect that. In falconry there are more critics than actual falconers especially online...Not many would do as you are doing. Look at how many people lurk and just shake their heads..You will always find doubters but keep your head up and know I appreciate it. I too am learning from this thread as I am sure many are....

kimmerar
05-29-2007, 08:59 PM
I love it Noah. I too appreciate what you are doing. One day your experiences will help me with a sharpie. I'm sorry for those judgemental people out there. Your posting will help ( no matter how Goose turns out)

Keep up the good work and thanks alot for all your time with this topic. [smilie=icon_pray.gif]

everetkhorton
05-29-2007, 09:20 PM
Kim: The falconer that does not use the computer and is talking people out of falconry maybe doing them a faver. This is not meant to be a negitive comment. It is a fact. But like you said this is another subject.

outhawkn
05-29-2007, 11:06 PM
Noah,That big baby boy of yours is looking so good I couldnt stand it. I ordered one too. Only I got a female. Anxious to see it. Supposed to be here Thursday.

Falcon Boy
05-29-2007, 11:30 PM
Day 31-

8am- Goose ate a good bit this morning, I fed him off the lure in his kiddy pool. He was vocal only about 10min on and off before he got the food [it was defrosting]. After he ate he jumped around and flapped and squawked for about 2-3minutes then was quiet.

I took Goose outside from 815am until 10am. I let him run around the yard while I cleaned the imprint tank and the kiddy pool. He is a real hoot outside, he will squawk at crows that fly over, eyeball sparrows, and if I get too far away he will scream and run over. I got a video of it today actually. Once he gets to me he quiets down, but when he is more than 20-30ft he screams and runs to me. It is kind of funny to watch actually. He also got himself up a wooden stair I was sitting on today, that was impressive. He ate again off the lure when I brought him back inside.

I was gone due to work from 415pm-1030pm. When I got back he still had food left and was dead silent. As 11pm rolled around he stared being vocal with his goose call, I think something scared him, I was upstairs when he started. After that I picked him up and brought him upstairs with me for the night.

All in all it was a good day. He was silent except this morning and a few minutes this evening [no more than 10]. Thatís pretty good in my book, although Iíve never raised an eyass before him so who am I to judge?

Last note, just learned something very important, take this into consideration if your wise. I was sitting here uploading pics with goose on my lap. Its hot in here, so i didn't have a shirt on. Well, let me tell you what happened. I look away for one second, and BOOM he latches onto my nipple. Want to talk about pain? OUCH. Note to all- wear a shirt around eyasses.

These pics were taken this morning, he has more feathering now on the back of his neck

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day31008.jpg

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day31006.jpg

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day31003.jpg

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day31005.jpg

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day31002.jpg

Flapping
http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/th_day31014.jpg (http://s74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/?action=view&current=day31014.flv)

Running to me screaming, then silent upon arrival
http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/th_day31015.jpg (http://s74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/?action=view&current=day31015.flv)

Do to someones comment, i will get another video of Goose with BF2 when he screams at the badguys LOL


Bill, if you dont mind me asking, how much did your female run? And is she 50/50 or 3/4gyr? What color gyr parent? And who from?

Lee
05-29-2007, 11:41 PM
Its not just eyass's FB my old redtail tried to eat my freckles on my arm. LOL

Falcon Boy
05-29-2007, 11:47 PM
I'm willing to bet a bite on the nipple hurts a lot more than a freckle on your arm LOL. My tattoo where it comes near my nipple didn't hurt that badly!

`Chris L.
05-30-2007, 08:50 AM
Noah,That big baby boy of yours is looking so good I couldnt stand it. I ordered one too. Only I got a female. Anxious to see it. Supposed to be here Thursday.

Bill

[smilie=eusa_clap.gif] ... let the fun begin. You have to post some pics. Cant wait to hear about her

Shortwingn
05-30-2007, 08:55 AM
Noah,
Just make sure you keep your pants on around the little guy!

Do you have live quail? It might be a good time to let him start killing things.

Falcon Boy
05-30-2007, 09:04 AM
I dont have any live quail, but today i plan on finding the info for a livestock auction about 45min away, they have rabbits/ducks/pigeons and i think quail.

outhawkn
05-30-2007, 09:22 AM
I dont have any live quail, but today i plan on finding the info for a livestock auction about 45min away, they have rabbits/ducks/pigeons and i think quail.

Hey Noah, For what its worth. You can have live quail sent to you using the Post Office. Its not all that expensive. Around $50.00 for a box and you can put a lot of quail in a box.
This Gyr/saker will be a 50/50. I ordered it from the same guy as you. Only he referred me to another guy who manages Bobby Kennedy"s breeding project. It will be light to white and got her for $1000.00

Falcon Boy
05-30-2007, 09:31 AM
Nice, not a bad price at all. You probably talked to Tom Cullen? He is the guy who actually set up my flight and had my bird as well, also out of Kennedy's project [smilie=icon_thumright.gif] How old will she be when you get her? This will be fun, can't wait to hear of her progress

Thanks for the info on the quail, i'll look into it.

chamokane
05-30-2007, 01:21 PM
Bill,

What do you plan to hunt with your hybrid?

Noah,

I have seen Gyr hybrids take an interest in nipples before. A friend of mine had his young female Gyr/Per flying loose in a sort of tame hack. We were sitting on his lawn when the bird flew down, hopped up on his lap and tried to bite his nipple. He moved and she just missed his nipple, which is a good thing because she made a bloody wound on his chest. Gyrs can really bite.

It looks like Goose has an interest in flowers. My imprint Peregrine likes them too. She likes to touch them with her beak and she will cock her head and bow to yellow flowers. She likes fruit too and she will bow and chup to apples, oranges and bananas. She doesn't want them, she just likes to flirt with them.

By the way, good luck with figuring out everything there is to know about screaming. None of my imprints have been objectionable with vocalization. My three worst screamers, in no particular order, have been: a brancher Redtail, a parent raised Harris and a passage Prairie.

Falcon Boy
05-30-2007, 01:24 PM
Dave- He is still small and didnt draw blood but by golly it hurt like a mofo. I still dont understand his screaming sometimes, but he is quieting down, which is a good thing [smilie=icon_thumright.gif]

outhawkn
05-30-2007, 03:59 PM
Nice, not a bad price at all. You probably talked to Tom Cullen? He is the guy who actually set up my flight and had my bird as well, also out of Kennedy's project [smilie=icon_thumright.gif] How old will she be when you get her? This will be fun, can't wait to hear of her progress

Thanks for the info on the quail, i'll look into it.

Yep, I did get it through Tom. I wonder if it isnt a half sister to yours? I dont know yet the exact age, Tom said he had a couple females he could band anytime. So I told him as soon as he banded it to ship. I will know when it arrives, but should be about 15-17 days old?

outhawkn
05-30-2007, 04:07 PM
Bill,

What do you plan to hunt with your hybrid?

Dave
I only have sharptails available here in any quantity, with a few ring-necks.
If I'm real lucky and the hybrid doesnt take to great of a pitch. I might be able to push a few ruffed grouse out of the forest and onto some fields. But I wont hold my breath on that one. Didnt really want a new bird but Noah went a got that cutey of his and well... [smilie=eusa_think.gif]

Falcon Boy
05-30-2007, 05:00 PM
Nice, not a bad price at all. You probably talked to Tom Cullen? He is the guy who actually set up my flight and had my bird as well, also out of Kennedy's project [smilie=icon_thumright.gif] How old will she be when you get her? This will be fun, can't wait to hear of her progress

Thanks for the info on the quail, i'll look into it.

Yep, I did get it through Tom. I wonder if it isnt a half sister to yours? I dont know yet the exact age, Tom said he had a couple females he could band anytime. So I told him as soon as he banded it to ship. I will know when it arrives, but should be about 15-17 days old?

Bill,
My birds dad was a silver gyr and the mother was a saker. I think they had 2 female sakers they were breeding, as well as 1 white parent gyr [gorgous bird but ~3oz smaller than the silver], a silver parent, and i think they used grey gyr as well [at least they have in the past]. It would be cool if your bird came from the same mom, or even same two parents? Do you know if it was white or silver gyr father?

I have pictures of the parents [dont remember if i posted them or not?] of my bird. I deleted the picture of the white gyr parent, but his chest was almost pure white, great looking bird, i think he flew at 1050g according to Wegner. Also, wait until you see the pictures from today, becuase last night 1/2-3/4 his chest feathers came in [smilie=icon_pidu.gif]

Good luck with her, can't wait to hear how she does!

outhawkn
05-30-2007, 06:17 PM
Nice, not a bad price at all. You probably talked to Tom Cullen? He is the guy who actually set up my flight and had my bird as well, also out of Kennedy's project [smilie=icon_thumright.gif] How old will she be when you get her? This will be fun, can't wait to hear of her progress

Thanks for the info on the quail, i'll look into it.

Yep, I did get it through Tom. I wonder if it isnt a half sister to yours? I dont know yet the exact age, Tom said he had a couple females he could band anytime. So I told him as soon as he banded it to ship. I will know when it arrives, but should be about 15-17 days old?

Bill,
My birds dad was a silver gyr and the mother was a saker. I think they had 2 female sakers they were breeding, as well as 1 white parent gyr [gorgous bird but ~3oz smaller than the silver], a silver parent, and i think they used grey gyr as well [at least they have in the past]. It would be cool if your bird came from the same mom, or even same two parents? Do you know if it was white or silver gyr father?

I have pictures of the parents [dont remember if i posted them or not?] of my bird. I deleted the picture of the white gyr parent, but his chest was almost pure white, great looking bird, i think he flew at 1050g according to Wegner. Also, wait until you see the pictures from today, becuase last night 1/2-3/4 his chest feathers came in [smilie=icon_pidu.gif]


Noah,
The father is a white gyr and the female is supposed to be light. I didnt ask about pictures. Color wasnt important to me. If you could repost the white parent that would be cool. I' have to check in with Tom tomorrow after the flight arrives. I'll ask him for more details. And will let you know.

Good luck with her, can't wait to hear how she does!

Falcon Boy
05-30-2007, 07:02 PM
I actually deleted the picture i had of the white parent once i decided to get the silver parent bird. Color didn't matter to me either, i wanted as big of a male as i could get since jacks are huge, which is why i chose the silver parent.

chamokane
05-30-2007, 07:49 PM
Bill,

What do you plan to hunt with your hybrid?

Dave
I only have sharptails available here in any quantity, with a few ring-necks.
If I'm real lucky and the hybrid doesnt take to great of a pitch. I might be able to push a few ruffed grouse out of the forest and onto some fields. But I wont hold my breath on that one. Didnt really want a new bird but Noah went a got that cutey of his and well... [smilie=eusa_think.gif]

Sharptails sound good to me. I see sharptails sometimes when I'm hunting but there is no open season on them here so I have to be sure I know what the dog is pointing before I turn the bird loose.

The next time I suddenly decide I need a new bird, I'm going to blame Noah too. [smilie=smileys13.gif]

Falcon Boy
05-30-2007, 08:04 PM
Fine by me [smilie=smileys13.gif]

Falcon Boy
05-30-2007, 09:54 PM
Day 32-

845am- Gave Goose his first feeding for the day off the lure. He was vocal for about 10minutes on and off for about 10seconds each time before being fed. After eating he screamed for about 10seconds, flapped around for a bit, and went to sleep. His morning vocalizations are definitely improving each day, meaning shorter and shorter periods of screaming, as is the vocalizing after eating.

Took Goose outdoors from 1030am-ish until noon. He was silent even when cardinals decided to bother him. He did vocalize once when my mom came out; he just did his little ďI know youĒ squeaks and ran over to us. He also did his ďscaredĒ call that sounds like a goose at a moth/butterfly that landed about 10ft away. Other than that he was quiet, and spent the whole time under a tree in the shade. I sprayed him gently with the hose and he spent about an hour preening. I had the mini-doxie out on a leash and the bird didnít really care.

I brought Goose in at noon and left a carcass in there for him to eat. He pulled at it immediately but then lost interest. I will leave a small plate of food in a few minutes as well incase he canít get food off the carcass [I scored the breast and legs of the quail].

1pm- I put some cut up food on top of the carcass and Goose ate it. He didnít pull from the carcass though. I donít think his neck muscles are quite strong enough yet.

Iíve had Goose on my lap from about 130pm and he will be here until around 3pm probably. Quick note, overnight his chest feathers came in, about 1/2-3/4 of them. His chest looks almost like an immature goshawk.

Just got an email back from a falconer in silver city. He said the jack population is high and he will show me many spots to fly the falcon. Sounds good to me!

Went to the gym from ~5-630. Goose was quiet the whole time according to the family and he was quiet when I got back. I took the carcass away earlier because he wasnít eating off of it and I didnít want it to go bad.

945pm- Iíve had Goose with me on the computer the past hour, and he will stay here until 11pm or 12am when I head to bed. Heís been very good today, very little vocalization, and lots of walking. All in all, another good day down on the books.


http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day32002.jpg

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day32005.jpg

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day32003.jpg

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day32007.jpg

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day32010.jpg

Ok. yes, he is headbanging in this video. I thought it was pretty sweet...
http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/th_day32014.jpg (http://s74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/?action=view&current=day32014.flv)

Jimmy
05-30-2007, 10:56 PM
He's looking good now. Not so damn ugly anymore.....

wesleyc6
05-31-2007, 10:31 AM
Noah,
It is mind boggling to see that feather explosion, isn't it! He is surely looking like a falcon. Even his eyes are appearing to "harden" in intensity. It really sounds like things are going well for you and that you are having a good time now!!!! Does he stay in the pool any hardly? [smilie=dontknow.gif] I bet he is out running around quite a bit! Have you won the family over to "falconry" with this little guy? Wait until you take him out and he flied 5 ft one day, then 10 ft and then the next day he just takes off and flies around the field 3 times. LOL. It will blow your mind to see how far he can fly when he decides to. Are you planning to tame hack him kind of? Or do you plan to already have lowered weight before he gets to roam the skies?

Good job!

Falcon Boy
05-31-2007, 11:56 AM
Wes,
He can't yet get over the sides of the pool but i'm sure thats in the next few days. I'll also have to start teathering him in the next few days. Unfortunatly there is no "safe" land around me to tame hack a bird, so once he's up and ready i will have his weight lowered a bit.

Luckily my family is supportive of falconry, so nobody to really win over. My dad is the only one who doesn't really like it but i don't live with him anyway so it doesnt matter [smilie=icon_thumright.gif]

Falcon Boy
05-31-2007, 10:35 PM
Day 33-

530am- EARLY. Need I say more? Today I agreed to give a guest lecture on genetics for my former AP bio teacher, so naturally I brought Goose along. He saw about 6 full classes of kids, 30-40 kids per class. He did fantastic. Not a peep the entire day except for when a plane flew over and he did his goose sounding call. This morning was by far his best morning yet, he screamed for about 2 seconds when he realized I was awake, and that was it.

With the students, I took Goose outside with the kids and had the kids sit in a large circle. Iíd put Goose in the middle and just let him be him. He ran to just about every kid, back and forth across the circle, pecking at shoes, flapping, feaking on peopleís legs, and freely preening while the kids touched him. He didnít bite anyone or make any noises what so ever with the kids. I donít want to say he did perfect, but I really donít know any other words for it. He far surpassed any expectations I had for him.

Around 330pm I went to my dads house for a bit to visit with my brother. Goose was silent here as well, and I finally got home around 730pm.

Around 745pm he got bored and started screaming [he was alone while I was putting things away upstairs]. My family came back indoors around 750pm and he was silent again. He screamed maybe a minute and a half total of those 5 minutes.

Goose didnít eat very much today. This morning he ate about ľ of a crop, he had about the same if not less around noon, and around 730 he ate a bit.

9pm- Everyone went to bed for the most part [the kids anyways] and Goose got a bit noisy so I brought him upstairs. He quieted down within 5 minutes or so. I also gave him a quail carcass to try and eat, with the breast meat heavily scored.


Sorry for the bad pictures, but it was dark when i took them because i forgot to bring the camera to school

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day33001.jpg

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day33002.jpg

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day33004.jpg


**EDIT**

1045pm- Goose ate a bit pulling from a quail carcass!

outhawkn
06-01-2007, 09:17 AM
Noah,
You probably know this but if Goose gets hot and you give him a spray or two. You can take a plastic water or soda bottle freeze it. Then lay it down where he can get to it. Nyla was hot already yesterday so I gave her a cold one and she laid on it for several hours. I kkep a couple bolltes froze for that purpose. It works good for me.

Falcon Boy
06-01-2007, 10:34 AM
Bill,
I have offered him a frozen ice pack a few times and he never seems to use it. I still put one out whenever he seems hot, but i'm yet to see him sit on it. [smilie=dontknow.gif]

-noah

Falcon Boy
06-01-2007, 10:50 PM
Day 34-

8am- Woke up to a very hungry and somewhat vocal Goose. He has been more vocal before, but this was worse than yesterday, Iím assuming because of the time difference. Iím going to start hauling my ass out of bed earlier to get him food. Today, as I have for the past few days, I put his food on the lure in the kiddy pool, than brought him to it.

1035am- I had Goose out front for about an hour and half while I cleaned his kiddy pool and let him run around. He actually went up three stairs! I got a few short videos of him running around and flapping on the porch. Tomorrow we are going to start tetheringÖ that should be interesting.

Goose was silent from 1035am until I went to work at 3pm. I was told he was near silent the entire time I was gone. When I got home he got a bit vocal. I brought him upstairs in the imprint tank and he screamed [he doesnít like it much] but I will take him out of it in a few minutes after he quiets down, in hopes of teaching him that screaming doesnít get what you want.

1045pm- Ended up put Goose to bed early. He didnít stop screaming, even after I took him out. He wasnít eating either. I think he just really hates the imprint tank. I will try not to keep him in there at night anymore, that should be a fun battle with the parents. He tried to jump the walls todayÖ and almost succeded.


http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day34010.jpg

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day34005.jpg

Yes, he jumped up this http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day34004.jpg

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day34003.jpg

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day34006.jpg

Short video, the screaming was because a big moth landed right out of the camera shot.
http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/th_day34014.jpg (http://s74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/?action=view&current=day34014.flv)

Falcon Boy
06-02-2007, 10:27 PM
Day 35-

630am- Bird was noisy when I brought him downstairs before work. He didnít eat while I was home, but screamed a good bit. My parents said he quieted down pretty quickly [less than 5 minutes] and ate within 10-15 minutes of me leaving.

11am- Got home from work and Goose was sleeping. He woke up and was quiet until around noon. At noon I took him outside to clean his kiddy pool and I let him run around for two hours. I decided not to start tethering him today, as I wanted to give his legs another day to get more exercise. He is also not really able to fly yet, so I wasnít too worried about it. Tomorrow I will start tethering, even though I love watching him run across the yard. He has been somewhat vocal, and not food related, and Iím not sure why. Even so, itís still not as bad as he had been, and even if he stays as he is now it is definite improvements over the first few days.

Gooseís feathers are almost all the way in now, at least on his body and his back. He is starting to look like a real falcon. I am curious how much he weighs now, I wonder if he will be big enough for jack rabbits. Iíll have to talk to some folks flying longwings on them and get their opinions.

217pm- So much for not tethering Goose todayÖ he just jumped out of the kiddy pool. Time to make jessesÖ oh joy!

830pm- Goose does not, under any circumstances, like this tethering business. He was quiet the first 2-3 hours, but after that once he figured out he couldnít go where he wanted he started screamingÖ and flappingÖ and runningÖ and did I mention screaming? Itís been probably close to an hour of it so far, hopefully he will stop soon. Iíve never even seen a passage flip out this much about being tethered.

I also gave Goose a quail carcass earlier. This time I cut the sternum off, but left some ribs. Then I cut off all the breast and leg meat and put it inside the ribcage. Goose ate it all, and really tore up the carcass, ripping off both wings. Heís sure getting big!

850pm- GREAT NEWS! I was able to get the hood on Goose twice for about 5-10seconds without a lot of fighting. Gosh I am stoked! He didnít even shake it at all, just let me slip it on, then held his head up and sometimes to the side. I am very excited, this is a huge improvement over how he was before.

1025pm- Goose finally calmed down around 10pm and went to sleep.

Bird was wet in the pictures, so please forgive his unkept appearence :P


http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day35002.jpg

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day35006.jpg

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day35007.jpg

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day35011.jpg

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day35012.jpg

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day35014.jpg

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day35015.jpg

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day35021.jpg

Should i continue this log? Does anyone still enjoy reading it? [smilie=dontknow.gif]


Just weighed him... 35oz! Wonder if the scale was right? it went between 34.5-35.5oz

Shortwingn
06-03-2007, 08:03 AM
keep up the log. It will also be good for you to look back on in a few years. How is the teathering going?

Falcon Boy
06-03-2007, 08:59 AM
I will keep a log for myself, i was unsure whether people wanted me to keep posting it or not.

I just started tethering yesterday, and he hated it, screamed yelled etc for a few hours on and off. I had to leave at 6am this morning so i'm not sure how he is doing this morning, i'm hoping better!

kimmerar
06-03-2007, 09:50 AM
Good job noah. I'm still reading it. You have me wondering about the tethering. If you stop I definately still want to hear about problems - like the tethering. Should you have started sooner or would this happen anyway. Probably.

anyway - whatevery you decide - Thanks for posting what you have posted.

Nor4
06-03-2007, 10:33 AM
Hi I'm new to this forum. Keep up the log, it's really interesting. I'm gonna get my female (parent reared) gyr/saker soon. I can't wait to get her.

Falcon Boy
06-03-2007, 12:26 PM
I just wasn't sure if people were still reading it or not. I should have started tethering a day or two earlier, as soon as the bird could really motor around well, but not well enough to hop. I think Erik told me that, but being dumb and ignorant i didn't start until now. Just called my mom [im still at work] and she said he has been a lot better than yesterday about the tether, so that's good news. I forgot to mention yesterday i reoiled his anklets [with olive oil] and i put olive oil on his legs to try and prevent scale damage from bating.

Falcon Boy
06-03-2007, 10:22 PM
Day 36-

Worked from 7am-1pm. Goose was left with food tethered to his perch and I had my mom check on him throughout the day as she was home. She said Goose was silent and didnít bate hardly ever.

I got home and he had a ton of food left, and he had picked the quail I left him with down to the bones, a great sign! He was a bit vocal at times, on and off for about 10minutes when he wanted to be noisy. It wasnít food screaming, just the pissed off because he was tethered I think.

Hooding went well today, I only tried it three times and he didnít dodge at all, just a few peeps and then sat silent with it on. This is a huge improvement over the first few days; his fear seems to have dissipated greatly.

Gooseís tail is in about 3-4 inches now, and his wing feathers are getting longer. His only real down left is on his legs, and a bit on his head, and a tiny bit on his wings in random spots. He is starting to look like a real falcon, and a gorgeous one at that, he has 5 distinct colors on him, a dark brown, light brown, blonde, sunglow blonde, and a crŤme color. Heís neat looking to say the least. Now I just have to get him killing and silent, but hopefully that will come with time.

I changed Gooseís set up again today. He is now tethered to his block, with a tarp underneath, and a few Astroturf mats around it, as well as his nest box.

Sorry for the short log again, but I forgot to do it throughout the day and itís hard to remember everything in the evening.


http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day36001.jpg

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day36004.jpg

Video of Goose preening
http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/th_day36007.jpg (http://s74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/?action=view&current=day36007.flv)

Shortwingn
06-04-2007, 08:00 AM
Hi Noah,
Might be a good time to get him eating rabbits. Get him orientated to the prey item(dead). That helped leaps and bounds with mine.

`Chris L.
06-04-2007, 09:53 PM
Noah,
keep up the log. I may not comment (or others) but know we are reading. Thank you for taking the time to do it.

Falcon Boy
06-04-2007, 11:32 PM
Day 37-

830am- Oh the joy of screaming, Iím about ready to cut my ears off. Woke up and the bird was quiet, so I started warming up his food. He was in the computer room overnight so I went and hopped on the computer, and got to listen to him scream for 5 minutes. Once his food was done I brought it up, hooded him, put the food to his side, and then unhooded him. I gave him a quail carcass that was partially cut up. He screamed for another minute then realized it was there. He took about a bite and then stopped eating to sit and scream at the walls. Since he wasnít eating I took 2 small pieces while he had his back turned and put them in the hood. He ate both immediately upon seeing them. Hopefully that will strengthen his bond with the hood at least a bit. After that he went back to the carcass for a minute, then stopped and started trying to outrun his tether [while screaming of course]. This went on for a minute or two then he stopped. Iím trying to figure out where I went wrong. To my knowledge he has never seen me with food, I have always used a blocker. He has, in general, been a lot more vocal since tethering started. Iím half hoping that being tethered still pisses him off [which is quite obvious at times] and that is why he is more vocal. I guess time will tell? Anyway Iím kicking myself in the ass trying to figure out what the next step is. Tomorrow I will get up at 6am to feed him, hopefully feeding earlier will prevent the screaming issues. Itís now 915am and he is silent and preening. Before now I never knew how truly great silence was. There is definitely something to be said for passage birds, or a properly done imprint for that matter. Perhaps I have messed up somewhere and not realized? Perhaps it is just a stage. Time will tell I suppose.

1015am- Goose has been silent since his episode, thank goodness! Hasnít eaten anymore but there is a vacuum going outside the room and he really couldnít care less. He is still testing the tether, but at least he isnít screaming while doing it.

Ended up running out to the vetís office for my dog from 1030-1230. I brought Goose and he behaved perfectly. Unfortunately we had to put my dog down, which was not what we had intended, but she had a lot of issues and her quality of life was not going to improve even with hundreds of dollars of treatment. Anyway, he behaved perfectly, I brought him in his nest box and he just sat silently and pulled on a carcass every now and again.

When we got back I was home for a bit then had to head to work. My parents said he was great while I was at work. He had eaten the carcass down to bones, so he was hungry when I got home and started screaming. I put his food upstairs and brought him to it. He ate a little and then quieted down. I let him roam around the room all night, and he jumped 3ft up on to my knee while I was eating. Scared the bejesus outta me but itís good to know he can jump.

I tried putting the perch behind the laptop but he jumped off onto my laptop. So thatís out. Right now heís running around the computer table. Ah the fun of an eyass.

Im stealth...
http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day37008.jpg

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day37007.jpg

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day37006.jpg



EDIT* Bird weighed 34oz at the vets today empty

outhawkn
06-05-2007, 08:16 PM
EDIT* Bird weighed 34oz at the vets today empty[/quote]

Noah, are you sure thats a bird? 34 oz already, heck it might be an elephant! [smilie=smileys13.gif]

I am having to add food to mine every couple hours. She is a bottomless pit! I leave a wad of food the size of my fist at night and by morning its all gone. She sits and watches the sun creep across the floor until about 8am, then I start pumping food into her ...Again.

Falcon Boy
06-05-2007, 09:04 PM
Yep, i weighed him on the vets scale around noon and he hadn't eaten since the morning feeding. Even in the morning, he did not eat a terribly large amount. My bird doesn't seem to eat during the night the few times i left food in there overnight, i noticed it tended to rot or at least get drier than i'd want him eating, but then again he was older than your eyass is when i did that.

Goose is really getting huge! Can't wait till hard penn :) Today has been a better day, i'll make my log post late tonight as i have a phone call to make when i get off work.

Any chance of an updated picture of your bird?

wesleyc6
06-05-2007, 10:13 PM
I too am enjoying reading about your bird Noah. Please continue. It is interesting to read.

He is getting huge!!!!

Falcon Boy
06-06-2007, 11:46 PM
Day 38-

Goose was quieter than normal this morning. I had him run to his meal outdoors on the lure, which he did without issue. Tomorrow Iíll try and get him to go about 3ft, so far he has gone about two maximum. Though out the day he had spells of noisyness, mostly oriented towards me. Tomorrow I am going to start giving him one feeding at night to start flashlight training him should the time come where he is out past dark. Sorry for the short log, its 2am and Iím tired.

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day38002.jpg

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day38006.jpg


Day 39-

Once again I forgot to do the log throughout the day but I was busy. Goose was LOUD anytime I walked into the room. Food association at itís finest, BUT Iíve figured out why, or at least a possible source as to why. While at home, I have been leaving him downstairs in the main room. I am hardly ever in the main room, so he was seeing me about 15min before feeding times to 15min after. Therefore making the only time he saw me when he got fed. Stupid mistakeÖ wonít happen again. Now he will be physically with me constantly while Iím home. Right now heís sitting on the computer table. My normal routine is while downstairs he is tethered to his block [which he now sits on most of the day], while outdoors he runs around on a creance, and while upstairs in the computer room he is either tethered or just allowed to romp around depending on the time and how long we spent outdoors earlier. If we werenít out for more than an hour or two than I let him romp around to get some of his energy out.

To modify the screaming behavior I have put a few new things into effect. While Iím home, all feedings are now done on the lure, outdoors, with the lure pre-placed. I am making him run farther and farther to get the lure, today he went about 7ft to a live quail on the lure, and 3ft to chopped up quail. I am also bagging him on some 3week old quail I got today. He did well, killing the first immediately and the second one kind off gave him a little more fight but he showed it who was boss! He is learning that you use your feet to hold it down, then bite it, not just stand a few feet away and bite at it. I am also going to carcass feed him off a rabbit. I have to check my freezer still and see if there is one, if not I just ordered a big one from rodent pro along with some more food. While Iím not home, I will still leave him a plate of food if Iím gone longer than he needs to go between feedings.

Hooding sucked today, but mostly due to his food screaming, it made it difficult. I did get it on him once though. I had him take a piece of food out of the hood, then I slipped it on the next time and he didnít mind as much as he used to, although still resented it. While the hood was on his head I put a piece of food on the block, which he promptly ate after the hood came off.

So overall we have a screaming bird right now, but I donít think he is at the point of no return just yet [speaking from all my knowledge of 21 days with an eyass LOL]. Hopefully by correcting my mistakes of the past 2 days I can get my silent eyass back!

Once thing Iíve noticed and find a bit odd, he seems to be physically the size of a male saker falcon from the pictures Iíve seen, but he has a wider chest and head like a gyr falcon. I find it odd that he weighed 34oz but is very small in height. Either way, as long as he kills lots of jacks I donít care. Also, my size 8.5 hood does not fit him anymore, seems a bit small. Time to try the 9 or 9.5 and see if they fit better. Doesnít it figure I bought a 6.5, 7, 8, and 8.5, just to find out his head is bigger?

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day39001.jpg

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day39003.jpg

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day39009.jpg

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day39006.jpg

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day39008.jpg

Shortwingn
06-07-2007, 12:44 AM
Was he DNA sexed from the shell? Wouldn't that be funny if you got a female? If it's a big male all the better.
I wouldn't be too worried about the screaming right now, they all go through the terrible two's. Just do all you can do to stop it and feel good once it comes to an end.
Sounds like you might have lure trained your first imprint. 7' eh? Not too shabby.

Jimmy
06-07-2007, 07:08 AM
He's become quite the looker, Noah. Not so damn ugly anymore.
He'll be on the wing in no time. How do you plan to mount your telemetry?

Falcon Boy
06-07-2007, 02:06 PM
Erik- I am pretty sure he was DNA sexed, i dont know how else the breeder would know which eyasses to have for which prices?

Jimmy- As of now i am planning on doing a backpack harness, possibly a tailmount though

Falcon Boy
06-07-2007, 10:21 PM
Day 40-

I had to work 6am to 1pm so I left Goose at home. I got home and he was vocal for about 10 minutes than was quiet. As soon as he was a bit quieter I took him outdoors and he ran 8-10ft for a baggie quail tied to the lure with the minidoxie right next to him. He killed the quail and ate the head and that was all, it seems like it was fun to him to kill it and he wasnít real hungry.

Goose ate indoors at 330pm, I didnít realize I had left food from this morning. He ate about half a crop. Around 630/7 I will try another baggie quail, and try and get him to go 15ft.

On a good note, other than short bursts of noise, Goose has been silent. Much improved over yesterday. I also finally found a hood that fits, my size 11 Khan from Ken Hooke. I will have to order a new one sooner or later, as it has some water marks on it and looks a bit ugly. It appeared to fit him almost perfectly. So much for the size 6.5-8.5 hood size range I heard for male gyr/sakers. He does however hate the hood. Tonight I will give him tidbits out of it, and not hood him anymore. Tonight I will tidbit a few times out of it and stroke him with it. I will continue to do that for the next few days until he calms down. After hooding today [which didnít go well] he spent about 20minutes biting my fingures, and he is strong enough now where it doesnít feel so good.

I also noticed that Goose has a small cut under his federal band from bating. I will keep an eye on it.

630pm- Goose ran 15ft to kill a baggie quail on the lure with 2 of my brothers watching. So far he has killed in front of everyone in my family, tomorrow Iíll try and have him kill in front of everyone at once.

10pm- First time doing flashlight training with Goose and he took right to it. He immediately looked down at the lure, but it took him about 30seconds to figure out how to get off the perch. He would look like he was going to jump, then he would stop at the last minute. Well one time he didnít quite make the stop, and fell off onto the lure and ate immediately. Of course he screamed when he was on the block and couldnít figure out how to get down, but was silent once he was eating.

Overall today went over much better than yesterday. Screaming is down considerably, although still present around food times. Hooding didnít go well because I put the small hood on him. I did feed him four times today little tidbits out of the hood which he did not hesitate to eat, so hopefully itís just a matter of time since I found one that actually fits. After putting the small hood on Goose decided it was necessary to bite me every time I put my hand near him. He can really bite now, as my fingers can attest to. Hopefully that crap will stop soon.

On a side note, Iím pretty pissed at myself that he got the small cut on his leg from the federal band while bating.


http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day40008.jpg

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day40006.jpg

outhawkn
06-08-2007, 09:19 AM
[quote="Falcon Boy"]Day 40-

I had to work 6am to 1pm so I left Goose at home. I got home and he was vocal for about 10 minutes than was quiet. As soon as he was a bit quieter I took him outdoors and he ran 8-10ft for a baggie quail tied to the lure with the minidoxie right next to him. He killed the quail and ate the head and that was all, it seems like it was fun to him to kill it and he wasnít real hungry.

Goose ate indoors at 330pm, I didnít realize I had left food from this morning. He ate about half a crop. Around 630/7 I will try another baggie quail, and try and get him to go 15ft.

On a good note, other than short bursts of noise, Goose has been silent. Much improved over yesterday. I also finally found a hood that fits, my size 11 Khan from Ken Hooke. I will have to order a new one sooner or later, as it has some water marks on it and looks a bit ugly. It appeared to fit him almost perfectly. So much for the size 6.5-8.5 hood size range I heard for male gyr/sakers. He does however hate the hood. Tonight I will give him tidbits out of it, and not hood him anymore. Tonight I will tidbit a few times out of it and stroke him with it. I will continue to do that for the next few days until he calms down. After hooding today [which didnít go well] he spent about 20minutes biting my fingures, and he is strong enough now where it doesnít feel so good.

I also noticed that Goose has a small cut under his federal band from bating. I will keep an eye on it.

630pm- Goose ran 15ft to kill a baggie quail on the lure with 2 of my brothers watching. So far he has killed in front of everyone in my family, tomorrow Iíll try and have him kill in front of everyone at once.

10pm- First time doing flashlight training with Goose and he took right to it. He immediately looked down at the lure, but it took him about 30seconds to figure out how to get off the perch. He would look like he was going to jump, then he would stop at the last minute. Well one time he didnít quite make the stop, and fell off onto the lure and ate immediately. Of course he screamed when he was on the block and couldnít figure out how to get down, but was silent once he was eating.

Overall today went over much better than yesterday. Screaming is down considerably, although still present around food times. Hooding didnít go well because I put the small hood on him. I did feed him four times today little tidbits out of the hood which he did not hesitate to eat, so hopefully itís just a matter of time since I found one that actually fits. After putting the small hood on Goose decided it was necessary to bite me every time I put my hand near him. He can really bite now, as my fingers can attest to. Hopefully that crap will stop soon.

On a side note, Iím pretty pissed at myself that he got the small cut on his leg from the federal band while bating.
Noah, why is he biting do you think? Are you drawing the hood braces tight. I never pull them untill the birds is nearly hard penned.

Falcon Boy
06-08-2007, 11:27 AM
Noah, why is he biting do you think? Are you drawing the hood braces tight. I never pull them untill the birds is nearly hard penned.

I have never pulled the braces, i know that's a big no no. I think he is biting for two reasons- The past few days when he was downstairs i did not touch him or mess with him much. The other reason is becuase since he hates the hood so much [they were all small] he saw my hand attached to it. It's been getting better today as i touch him more frequently and he learns that the hood isn't so aweful, now he screams when he sees it but instantly jabs his head inside for food.

Falcon Boy
06-09-2007, 12:08 AM
Day 41-

930am- Woke up and Goose was vocal, but quieted down within 5 minutes of me coming in the room. I went outdoors to get the baggie set up on the lure, and then came in and grabbed Goose. He jumped around outdoors for a good bit, not really interested in the baggie on the lure. After about 45minutes he went and jumped on it and footed it a few times, then left the quail to attack my toes. About another half hour after that he ran over and killed the quail and ate it. After he was done I saw he didnít have much of a crop, so I ran inside and got another quail and threw it out while he wasnít looking. As soon as he saw it he ran after it, missed a few times but snagged it off the top of a stump. All of this was done with the dog present. He ate about half the quail then just stopped eating to go foot a few sticks. He was somewhat vocal in the beginning outdoors, screaming maybe every 5-10minutes for about a minute or two. Not as bad as before, but still annoying.

Worked from 3pm-930pm. When I got home Goose vocalized twice when I got home, but then was quiet. He ate a bit that I had left within a few minutes of me getting home then went back to his block. I ended up picking him up on the fist for about 5 minutes, but he was being noisy and I realized there would be no positive association with it since I couldnít give him a baggie and he wasnít hungry enough to feed him off the lure [he had just ate]. I ended up putting him back on the block. I then fed him three times out of the hood. Now he darts his head right into it, and Iím pretty sure the screaming is food screaming towards it now, not scared screaming. I got it on his head 2-3 times without huge issues. He vocalized the whole time, but it was food begging not fear screaming. So tomorrow I wonít feed out of the hood, just put it on him. This hood fits so much better itís unreal.

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day41004.jpg

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day41005.jpg

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day41006.jpg

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day41007.jpg

Jimmy
06-09-2007, 08:30 AM
Noah,
The bird is starting to look like a champ! but we could do without your ugly mug in the pics [smilie=smileys13.gif]
Have you weighed him lately? and is he trying to make short flights yet?

Falcon Boy
06-09-2007, 11:52 AM
I will weigh him today if i remember to. He hasn't really made any flights, he has done a few flapping falls of stumps and such,but no real flights yet.

chamokane
06-09-2007, 03:34 PM
Goose looks really good, powerful. He'll be on the wing before you know it.

Just a word of caution. Don't trust him too much in all that New Mexico sunshine for the first year or so. About the time he starts catching game and you think he loves you and will stay with you for ever, he might get drunk on thermals and end up in old Mexico. A few hundred miles can mean nothing to a bird like that.

Watch his weight, use the best telemetry you can find, use two transmitters, spend a lot of money on fresh batteries, keep your gas tank full, and carry a live lure if you can. I think I read that you are already doing some flashlight training.

Not trying to spook you (well, maybe a little), but young imprint falcons can break your heart.

Oh yeah, while your trying not to lose him, remember to have fun.

Falcon Boy
06-09-2007, 04:18 PM
Dave,
Thanks for the advice. I am planning on using a backpack mounted Merlin Systems 1/3 MX which i have heard gets 40miles easily and has a battery life of 30 days.

I weighed him today, empty, without a swivel, and he was 35.2oz. I emailed the breeder to find out if he was DNA sexed and he was. He said their females typically go at 50-52oz [Bill, your birds gonna be a monster!].

outhawkn
06-09-2007, 07:51 PM
Dave,
Thanks for the advice. I am planning on using a backpack mounted Merlin Systems 1/3 MX which i have heard gets 40miles easily and has a battery life of 30 days.

I weighed him today, empty, without a swivel, and he was 35.2oz. I emailed the breeder to find out if he was DNA sexed and he was. He said their females typically go at 50-52oz [Bill, your birds gonna be a monster!].

Noah. Is gonna be? Heck, I'm already slaughtering yearling calves! Well maybe not that bad. I will weigh her tomorrow. She has really big feet. She is talking a little while everyone is watching TV. But other than that is silent, hoods easily. And is coming along well. Of course now that I've bragged on her, her manners will turn to S**T!

Jimmy
06-09-2007, 08:02 PM
And is coming along well.

Uh Ohhh..... I've said that before........ [smilie=smileys13.gif]

Falcon Boy
06-09-2007, 09:33 PM
Yea i was on the phone with a friend today "yea Goose has quieted down a ton" *KAK KAK KAK KAK KAK* "i can tell" LOL

Falcon Boy
06-09-2007, 11:28 PM
Day 42-

Worked 645am-130pm. When I got home Goose was just relaxing on his perch. He vocalized 3-4 times while I picked him up, then hushed up. I took him outside to be social because there was a party going on for my little brotherís baseball team. Goose was perfect, silent and only bated once [after a sparrow, a good sign]. He let all the kids touch him without issue and really behaved perfectly, I donít know how else to describe it. His weight empty [no crop, small mutes] was 35.2oz without the swivel. I emailed the breeder to find out if they were DNA sexed. Even so, I might send a feather sample to be DNA sexed once he is older.

I just got an email back from the breeder. He said the eyasses were DNA sexed and their females usually fledge around 50-52oz.. I just found this info about gyr/sakers on hicks falcon farm website, but I guess maybe they have smaller birds.

Male 725gr -875gr 25.6oz - 30.9oz
Female 1125gr-1420gr 36.7oz - 50.1oz

4pm- Took Goose outside on the fist for his baggie today. When he looked the other way, I tossed it. He looked like he wanted to fly but didnít have the confidence. I knelt down and he jumped to the ground and ran down the quail. As he was eating I threw the lure out next to him, he didnít even lift an eye. The whole time the doxie was right next to the bird, he screamed at him once then went back to eating. Once done the quail, Goose ran over to the lure but didnít eat any food on it. After about 15minutes of him looking around I picked him up and brought him back indoors.

Interesting thing the breeder mentioned is that he said I shouldnít lower the weight until a month after hard-penning. He said that gyrís and sakerís depend on their parents during that time, and if you lower their weight they will start to whine at you. That actually works out well, because he should be ready to start having weight reduced right about the time I move to NM.

845pm- Goose got hungry around 845pm. I placed the lure outside, and then picked him up [he will now step up sometimes]. I brought him downstairs, then slipped the hood on. I kept him hooded [braces NOT drawn] till we were outside. Once 10ft from the lure, I knelt down and took the hood off. Goose jumped off the glove and ran over and started to feed. He was a bit vocal afterwards but nothing major.

Iím too tired for flashlight training tonight, plus Goose isnít hungry, so Iíll have to do it again tomorrow.


http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day42001.jpg

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day42003.jpg

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day42004.jpg

outhawkn
06-10-2007, 08:05 AM
And is coming along well.

Uh Ohhh..... I've said that before........ [smilie=smileys13.gif]

Whatever posessed me to type that I'll never know! [smilie=dontknow.gif]

wesleyc6
06-10-2007, 08:51 AM
wow Noah, he is all grown up now isn't he! I can't remember if I told you this before or not, but my bird went 5 foot one day, and 10ft the next day to kill a baggie and then the next day, he flew around the field a couple of times! They are similiar to a pigeon in that they can really go a long way the first time they decide to.

I need to get mine outside killing things too I guess. I hate to start it here with all the ants. I am about to only offer food twice a day to mine I guess too so that the lure becomes a little more of a tool.

This has been fun so far hasn't it. [smilie=banana.gif]

everetkhorton
06-10-2007, 10:09 AM
Wes: Sound like things are moving along nicely: I will not be long and she will be in the air doing her thing.

Falcon Boy
06-10-2007, 11:08 PM
Day 43-

Worked 645am-130pm. Goose was pretty good when I got home. He made a bit of noise around 4/5pm when he was starting to feel hungry but I forgot I left a piece of food near him and he ate that. I took him outdoors to feed off the lure at 730pm and he ran 10ft to it but only ate the guts of a quail, didnít want to pull at it. Iíll offer the rest tonight with the flashlight method. Hooding went pretty well before the feeding. He screams a bit when he sees it [food bond] but then once on he is pretty quiet. I hood him, put on the creance, and then walk out front to where the lure is. Once there I take the hood off and kneel, and he jumps off the fist to the food.

11pm- Fed goose off the lure with the flashlight. As soon as it clicked on he started food screaming on his block but was afraid to jump down since he couldnít see the ground. I picked him up on the fist and put him on the ground and he ran right over.


http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day43006.jpg

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/day43004.jpg

Shortwingn
06-11-2007, 10:38 PM
Hi Noah,
I have found it is better to offer the lure and after a bag. If they dont eat the bag use it the next day on the lure. I wouldnt be surprised if he maxes out your creance in a week or two.

Falcon Boy
06-14-2007, 07:30 PM
http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/6.jpg

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/6-1.jpg

outhawkn
06-14-2007, 07:42 PM
Nice job Noah, you can be proud of the falconry your practicing.

Falcon Boy
06-14-2007, 07:59 PM
Thanks, but I won't be proud until the kinks are worked out and we are killing things. I worked double time last week so screaming is still present occationally and biting has started but we are working through that. Getting him to eat the rabbit was a task.... he ate some quail at 9am then i kept offering the rabbit throughout the day and nothing. It was split open and gutted for him. Wouldn't touch it. Eventually i got fed up with it and cut off a foreleg and brought it inside for him to eat. Hopefully tomarrow he will eat the carcass.
I screwed up hooding pretty well too in the begginning, havnt decided what i'm going to do about that. I think that was the cause of the biting.

I'd like to see pictures of your bird when you get a chance! [smilie=banana.gif]

Shortwingn
06-14-2007, 08:26 PM
First off there is no such thing as a perfect 1st time imprint! For that fact the third and fifth will have problems. Then all things will come together and life should be wonderful.
I got my imprint today and it will be perfect but it took me a bunch to get here! How can I say this, many f#@$ups, all learning.
Make him the best you can do and get better. Soon all the chamber people will shart.

I am going to try to start a "how to log" but it is a busy time for me.

everetkhorton
06-15-2007, 10:54 AM
Erik:
The more logs that are kept the better a new person will be at imprinting. I think we have all learned something from Noah log. Yes, we will all still make mistakes, but fewer of them. Each bird is different. JMO. [smilie=eusa_think.gif]

Shortwingn
06-15-2007, 05:58 PM
Ev,
I am not criticizing at all! Just trying to point some things out(I probably don't have to but others might benefit from it). I wish I had a resource like this when I started imprinting. My ears would work a lot better. With all this sharing of information it makes me wish I could live to meet some of the newer falconers apprentices six generations down the line.

Falcon Boy
06-15-2007, 08:29 PM
Erik,
Question for you. The past two days i offered Goose a big ole' rabbit carcass [it was white and brown, would that matter?]. The rabbit was 6.25lbs gutted and i left it open for him at feeding time. He would not touch it. Matter o fact, he missed his evening meal last night becuase he wouldn't touch it, and then again this morning he wouldn't touch it. Last night i cut off a foreleg and let him eat that[not much food at all, but so he'd see the colors and realize it's food]. Still wouldn't hit the rabbit today. I got worried about him not eating for an extended period of time for an eyass and screaming more [everyone within two miles of my house knows he's good at it when he wants to be....] and gave him some sparrows to much on about mid-day. I put the sparrows on the carcass and he still wouldn't eat the rabbit after eating the sparrows. Any ideas?
thanks

Falcon Boy
06-16-2007, 08:02 AM
Here is a vid i put together of Goose from 19 days until hardpenning

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xXWS7ZJMJWA

Shortwingn
06-16-2007, 09:15 AM
Hi Noah,
Might want to try putting some chopped quail or what you had been feeding him before on top of the carcass. Let him have a feed or two and reduce the proportion. He should begin to rip the carcase as well and recognize it as a food item.

Falcon Boy
06-16-2007, 10:00 AM
Erik,
I will try that again when i get a new rabbit. I ended up chopping the other one up becuase i didn't want it to go bad and didn't have enough freezer space [new hawk food arrived a few days ago]
thanks

`Chris L.
06-16-2007, 08:56 PM
Noah, sounds like your coming along. He is looking good. Thanks for all of the updates, it is great to follow you through this.

Thanks again

Falcon Boy
06-16-2007, 09:06 PM
I don't think i will be keeping a daily log anymore, as for the next month, per the breeder's advice, i am going to keep him fat and just work on lure work. He's pretty vocal around food time still, and i still have to feed him 3x a day. I tried going to twice a day... but the headache was in no way worth it.

gabboon
06-17-2007, 02:04 AM
I am planning on using a backpack mounted Merlin Systems 1/3 MX ].

Have you put on the back pack mount yet? I think I will use one on my Harris', but might need an experienced hand to assist. My only experience has been with satellite transmitters and that's a bit different. Plus it doesn't matter if those birds don't like me after the experience.

Shortwingn
06-17-2007, 02:47 AM
Hi Noah,
Keep the log going if you will. At least until the first kill. There might be more help than you think.

Falcon Boy
06-17-2007, 07:47 AM
Steve- I havn't ordered my backpack yet, i had one then it got lost when i moved back from NY. I have installed one on a 5yr old pere/prairie last year, but it was the only time i've done it and i installed it a bit loose and he was mean as hell. He would bite even with the hood on and made it hard to put it on so it was kind of a rush job. He ended up ripping it off the next day anyway. I would be more than willing to help you though if you want if i'm still in town, i leave august 10.
Here is a thread of the install i did a last year, i can a mistake in the pics looking back at it, one side of the strap on the front was a bit looser than the other,which i think explains why the stitch broke. Please excuse the perch used in the pics, but as the thread says it was just for the install. The other perch was only used until my friends new block arrived, which was actually 2hrs after the picture was taken [go figure]



Erik- I will keep it updated then although probably not everyday. Since the breeder told me to keep him fat for a month after hardpenning i'm not going to really start flying him to late july/early august, and by that point i'm contimplating just waiting another week and a half until i move since the fields are tiny here in MD.

Jimmy
06-17-2007, 10:38 AM
What's the theory on keeping him fat for another month? Are you trying to lose the vocalness? Ain't gonna happen..... [smilie=eusa_sick.gif]

Is he trying to make flights yet? Noah, you can take this for what it's worth. But, I think I'd fly him free for the first time, where you are now. At least if things went sour, you'd be familair with the area. It would suck to move to a new place, and lose him on the first couple of flights because you didn't know the layout of the land.......

Falcon Boy
06-17-2007, 11:30 AM
The breeder said that gyr's tend to rely on their parents for a longer amount of time than most other species so by keeping him fat a month it will lessen the chances of screaming becoming worse. As of now he's still eating 3x per day and if he misses one you are gonna hear about it....

Anyone else have an opinion? points well taken thanks jimmy, i'll think about it.

outhawkn
06-17-2007, 11:59 AM
The breeder said that gyr's tend to rely on their parents for a longer amount of time than most other species so by keeping him fat a month it will lessen the chances of screaming becoming worse. As of now he's still eating 3x per day and if he misses one you are gonna hear about it....

Anyone else have an opinion? points well taken thanks jimmy, i'll think about it.

Noah, what are you thinking man! To ask if anyone else has an opinion, you should now by now I ALWAYS have an opinion. [smilie=smileys13.gif]

But this time I'm actually going to give it some thought, and will post my thoughts tonight.
I agree with jimmy, I would fly him free where he is used to flying the first time or two if possible. They develope great homing instincts.
JMO

outhawkn
06-17-2007, 12:02 PM
http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/6.jpg

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/6-1.jpg

Please tell me that aint the..Easter Bunny. [smilie=eusa_naughty.gif]

chamokane
06-17-2007, 03:53 PM
The breeder said that gyr's tend to rely on their parents for a longer amount of time than most other species so by keeping him fat a month it will lessen the chances of screaming becoming worse. As of now he's still eating 3x per day and if he misses one you are gonna hear about it....

Anyone else have an opinion? points well taken thanks jimmy, i'll think about it.

Noah,

I haven't flown a gyr hybrid myself but I have seen them become pretty unpleasant when their weight was cut too soon. They were noisy and they didn't want to fly or take the hood and they seemed a little crazy and unhappy. Gyrs can be intelligent and affectionate but also temperamental.

On the other hand, they can take a long time to start killing game and at some point they need to be hungry to understand the facts of life. If the breeder has had a lot of experience flying this type of bird, I would listen to his advice on the timing.

If it's pretty congested where you live, you might want to wait until you get to NM to fly him much. Some young falcons can get adventurous and they can cover a lot of ground in a hurry. It might be a lot easier to get him back in the open desert where he can see you and you can see him. I try to use a really open area with a reasonable number of roads to train falcons.

Shortwingn
06-18-2007, 02:22 AM
Hi Noah,
I have always believed in windows. There is a time for a young bird to learn. Miss the window and its gone. Sure with a bunch of hard work you can turn around a marred bird but if you hit that window it is a seamless transition.
With a hard imprint you shouldn't need to cut them as hard as a chamber or passage bird. You might find your hard imprint flys just for fun. Why not do the creance work with your bird and see how he handles it. Make it a game. Take the weight down real slow, perhaps 3-5 grams a day. You might see a game become real serious for your eyass in a hurry. Either way he will build flight mussel (something he would be doing if he were in a natural setting), get airtime and build confidence. Imprints are all about confidence. That's why some people refer to them as "that crazy imprint". Nothing ever told them it cant be done. Throw bags and keep one with you as a fail safe if you feel its right to cut him lose. Dont go too crazy with bags as you could miss that window and he might think bags are the goal of life, same with the lure, fist, etc.
Imprints as I see them are a labor of love. As the soup natzi from Sienfeld said "I suffer for my soup". Just like soup you will get out of it what you put into it.

Saluqi
06-20-2007, 10:41 AM
Hey Noah,

I just read this last page of entries and couple of things come to mind with regard to your bird's fear of rabbits. First I would make a rabbit lure, pretty simple to buy a cheap dog training retriever dummy, I just googled this place http://www.gundogsupply.com/dummies.html, and they have the canvas ones for $8.50. You can pick up a rabbit skin w/fur at a hobby shop and sew it to the dummy, you might want to make some ears too. Then replace your normal lure with this one. It's function is pretty obvious.

The other thing that you can do is buy a small young rabbit in as close to a natural color as possible, and kill and freeze it whole. You have now created Mr. Frosty. Keep Mr. Frosty in the freezer and get a length of para chord with one of those spring loaded button locks like they use on outdoor parkas and such for closing the hood - know what I mean? They sell them at sewing supply stores for like 50 cents each. Make a loop with the chord and the button lock and put it around Mr. Frosty's neck and put a tantilizing chunk of red meat under it and cinch it down. Now when your bird is really hungry bring him to the rabbit lying in the grass and just set him next to it and make sure he sees the meat. He will eventually eat the meat. You can do this repeatedly with the same Mr. Frosty and eventually he'll be bating at the rabbit, I believe this will imprint a prey image on your birds brain. If you ever want to do some restrained pursuits I can fill in a bunch of details for you.


Paul

Lee
06-20-2007, 02:19 PM
Here in the east there are lots of hills and lots of cover something to remember when you fly free, if you do fly free here, find the biggest field you possible can and by big I mean 50 acres or more those big falcons can cover some ground in a short amount of time. Have you thought of using a Kite or balloon for waiting on training? You might want to teach him to wait on so you can fly upland game and ducks just in case the jack rabbit flights dont pan out you always need a back up plan. If it were me I would start flying him to the lure and then start kite or balloon training MAKE SURE YOU INTRODUCE THEM ALOT I made a bad mistake last year but not showing my bird the kite enough she would fly great to the balloon but when I switched to the Kite due to strong winds whipping threw it, she spooked and hauled tail never to be seen again and I introduced her to the Kite a week before I flew her too it, and she still spooked. I think you should introduce him to feathered quarry first, I dont know how well the jack rabbit hawking is going to go with a tiercel he may get bucked off a few times and stop flying them, and then it might be harder to retrain him to go up and wait on IF the blunt of your training is at ground quarry??? I dont know if it makes a difference but if it were me I would want him up a few hundred feet regardless of quarry I just think if you start him on tail chases at jacks you might ruin him for feathers. Plus the balloon or kite will keep him focused on the bait line and it may help keep him from playing or raking off as much. Just a thought??

outhawkn
06-20-2007, 09:08 PM
Here in the east there are lots of hills and lots of cover something to remember when you fly free, if you do fly free here, find the biggest field you possible can and by big I mean 50 acres or more those big falcons can cover some ground in a short amount of time. Have you thought of using a Kite or balloon for waiting on training? You might want to teach him to wait on so you can fly upland game and ducks just in case the jack rabbit flights dont pan out you always need a back up plan. If it were me I would start flying him to the lure and then start kite or balloon training MAKE SURE YOU INTRODUCE THEM ALOT I made a bad mistake last year but not showing my bird the kite enough she would fly great to the balloon but when I switched to the Kite due to strong winds whipping threw it, she spooked and hauled tail never to be seen again and I introduced her to the Kite a week before I flew her too it, and she still spooked. I think you should introduce him to feathered quarry first, I dont know how well the jack rabbit hawking is going to go with a tiercel he may get bucked off a few times and stop flying them, and then it might be harder to retrain him to go up and wait on IF the blunt of your training is at ground quarry??? I dont know if it makes a difference but if it were me I would want him up a few hundred feet regardless of quarry I just think if you start him on tail chases at jacks you might ruin him for feathers. Plus the balloon or kite will keep him focused on the bait line and it may help keep him from playing or raking off as much. Just a thought??

I agree , I use a kite and have an overhead fan in the living room.Directly over her. Every morning I hang the kite from the fan. I then feed her and with my hand I spin the fan. It rotates around about 6-8 times and she cares less.I then remove it and turn the fan back on. Later when she is older and we start kite training for real, she will expect to see the kite above her and it SHOULD go smooth. (Of course now that I said it , that wont happen).

Falcon Boy
06-21-2007, 10:01 AM
Lee- If you can find a 50 acre field in my part of maryland... you got a good thing going. I don't think we even have a 50 acre field up near where gabboon is. From everyone i've talked to out in NM, flying longwings on jacks doesn't need a pitch, usually the bird is flown off the fist or off a pole.

Paul- Thanks for the idea about the frozen rabbit and the dummy. I'll pick up a dummy today while i'm out. I might take you up on some info about the restrained pursuits once i get the bird going well to the new lure.

kimmerar
06-21-2007, 10:51 AM
If you ever want to do some restrained pursuits I can fill in a bunch of details for you.

Paul - I would love to hear your details - when you get a chance

Falcon Boy
06-21-2007, 12:26 PM
http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/6-4.jpg

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/6-3.jpg

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/6-2.jpg

gabboon
06-21-2007, 01:38 PM
Its not been hot here in MD lately so I know someone just likes taking pictures of himself. Please leave the shirt on! There might be children viewing this stuff. [smilie=smileys13.gif]

Falcon Boy
06-21-2007, 04:08 PM
I was in syracuse from august until may.... it's hot here [smilie=smileys13.gif]

sevristh
06-21-2007, 04:11 PM
Its not been hot here in MD lately so I know someone just likes taking pictures of himself. Please leave the shirt on! There might be children viewing this stuff. [smilie=smileys13.gif]

[smilie=wut.gif] [smilie=eusa_clap.gif]

Falcon Boy
06-27-2007, 10:49 PM
Little update for y'all- Goose has quieted down so much it's unreal. He is still eating twice a day.... but if i try to skip the morning feeding everyone in the county knows about it. He is a bit vocal if i let him get hungry, but other than that generally silent. I no longer worry about him screaming his ass off everytime i try and make a phone call... which is nice.

I am currently working on wedding him to a knew lure after leaving the other 4 outside and having raccoons drag them off during the night. Yes, it happened four times, and yes it took me four times to learn not to leave them outside on the porch [smilie=eusa_doh.gif]

I havnt pushed hooding at all because he would bite like a maniac whenever he saw my hands. Biting has pretty much stopped now though, which my hands are thankful for.

Anyway, he isn't bad for a first imprint in my opinion. He is silent a majority of the time, and i've learned a ton from the experiance.

Side note- I gave him a baggie bunny a few days ago. He flew 15ft off the fist to hit it [he had never flown off the glove before] and grabbed it's butt. He held on for 2sec then let go and went to pout on a rock. I killed the bunny and he has been eating that the past few days.

Jimmy
06-28-2007, 10:14 AM
Sounds like progress to me!

Falcon Boy
06-28-2007, 05:00 PM
here is a picture a photographer took from last week

http://www.pictures-man.com/albums/album189/MLFAMILY_113.jpg

wesleyc6
06-29-2007, 05:53 PM
Good to see things are working out Noah!!!!! Can't wait to hear about all the bunnies he slays!

gabboon
06-29-2007, 07:53 PM
Noah,

I've got a nice block that I won in a raffle some years ago. I doubt I'll have any need for it anytime soon so you are welcome to it. It does not have a spike or base but it looks good. It was made by some guy in PA but I can't remenmber who. It is signed. If you want it give me a shout next time you are coming to Frederick and I can give it to you or leave it out to pick up.

outhawkn
06-29-2007, 08:16 PM
here is a picture a photographer took from last week

http://www.pictures-man.com/albums/album189/MLFAMILY_113.jpg

I love them blue feet!

Falcon Boy
06-30-2007, 12:44 PM
Noah,

I've got a nice block that I won in a raffle some years ago. I doubt I'll have any need for it anytime soon so you are welcome to it. It does not have a spike or base but it looks good. It was made by some guy in PA but I can't remenmber who. It is signed. If you want it give me a shout next time you are coming to Frederick and I can give it to you or leave it out to pick up.

If you don't want it i'd love to put it to good use [smilie=icon_thumright.gif] I'll let you know next time i'm headed up there.


Bill- I love the blue feet/cere as well. His beak is blue as well until the tip, where it is black.

`Chris L.
06-30-2007, 07:51 PM
Noah, I can hook you up with a spike if you want.. Steve is the block wood or metal? .. let me know if you need one Noah...

Oh , goose is look great. I cant wait to hear about thta first kill

gabboon
06-30-2007, 09:28 PM
Noah, I can hook you up with a spike if you want.. Steve is the block wood or metal?

is wood, let me know if you need any more info.

Falcon Boy
07-01-2007, 07:40 AM
Thanks guys! Chris i'll send you a PM when i go pick up the block, thanks a ton to you both! [smilie=banana.gif]

`Chris L.
07-01-2007, 10:08 AM
is wood, let me know if you need any more info.

Great I have a spike that would fit it perfect. Is it already drilled out, the hole for the spike??

If so I can weld a auger screw that will fit the hole on the spike for you. If its not drilled I will tell you what size you will need


here is a pic of it

http://i146.photobucket.com/albums/r253/Nafex/woodperchdismntl.jpg

let me know [smilie=icon_thumright.gif]

gabboon
07-01-2007, 12:37 PM
Great I have a spike that would fit it perfect. Is it already drilled out, the hole for the spike??

If so I can weld a auger screw that will fit the hole on the spike for you. If its not drilled I will tell you what size you will need


Hole is roughly 1/2" diameter x 4" deep. Block itself is 10" high and about 6" diameter. Its got that crappy daisy mat stuff on top so you might want a piece of astro turf to replace it. Heavily lacquered. I thought it had a name on it, but is just "MK 10/91"

Falcon Boy
07-05-2007, 07:35 PM
Time for honesty on my part, what i've done wrong, what i've done right, and why i'm where i am. Basically what i've learned from imprinting Goose.

A bit about Goose- He was never a quiet bird in the first place, he screamed from the moment he came off the plane. He went through phases of noise and quiet, but he was never the strong, silent type. Now he screams when he see's me a majority of the time, especially if he is hungry. Whether or not this is just a stage because i just cut him to one feeding a day two days ago, i do not know quite yet. But i do know that as of now he screams like a banshee when he wants to.

What do i think caused screaming? A few reasons. The second and third week i had him [weeks 3-4 for him] my hours at work got raised to 35/week, and Goose can't come to work with me. This meant he was eating 1/2-2/3 of his meals by himself.... not good in any way, and goes against everything thats ever been written on how to raise an imprint. After that my work schedule went back to usual, but he was still eating at least one meal a day by himself as i work afternoons into the night.

I was also kind of shafted by my family at some points, as when i come home half the time the door to the room he is in is closed so he can't see people walk by. This means that he sees me right when i walk in to get him and then he "finds" food, creating a food bond i think. Makes perfect sense, if you're in a room by yourself for 5 hours then the same person walks in and 5 minutes later you have food, it doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out where it comes from.

Biting is another issue I am dealing with. He will bite for seemingly no reason. I believe this is due to two reasons- Not enough touching him while he was young, and bad hooding on my part. I no longer hood him, but he sure as hell remembers it. If he sees a hood my hand should not be within leash distance or it's in for pain for at least a few days.

Here are some simple things, that will seem blatently obvious to most, but really need to be reconsidered if you're going to try and imprint a bird.
-Do not do it unless you can truly spend every waking second with the bird. My job got in the way, and now Goose and I both pay for it. My ears, and his brain.
-Make sure your family knows the deal and won't mess with your bird in any way, shape, or form. I caught my sister once moving Goose's food towards him [started screaming of course when she did and it never really stopped afterwards], but how many times did she do it before i caught her? My family also closes the door to the room he's in, which makes it so he doesn't see people walk by. A simple idea... but really key IMO so he doesn't get used to just seeing people around food time.
-Make sure you have months, not just to hardpenning time, to spend with the bird. Once my bird hardpenned i started going out more and working more again.... big mistake. Imprinting doesn't end at penning i've found out.

What to do-
-Do socialize the bird at every oppurtunity very early in life. Goose has been to BBQ's, schools, and stores. He will eat with a ride-on lawn mower two feet away going by or a car pulling up next to him.
-Prevent Food association at any cost.
-If i were to do it again i'd introduce the lure earlier to create a stronger bond. Goose will come instantly to the lure, but a stronger bond to it never hurt anyone.
-Spend every waking second with the bird until hardpenning if you can. After hardpenning do not cut down too much on time spent with the bird... as they can still pick up screaming.
-I think the bird should be touched while young. I know some people don't do it, some people do do it all the time. I think it's a judgement call. I messed up hooding which i think is the real cause of biting in Goose, but it could be related to him not knowing it from when he was tiny.
-Introduce the hood SLOWLY. Do not put it over it's head like a passage bird. The imprint must slowly adapt to it because their brain works differently. They WANT to be with you, so the hood has no positive association, it is something they learn to live with. With passage birds, they want you to go away so the hood becomes a positive thing.
-Start teathering earlier than i did with Goose. I would start as soon as the bird can walk/run well rather than waiting a few days.
-Put anklets/bells on early, possibly even before the bird can walk. That way they never know anything different and you're not replacing them every few days. Luckily Goose never pulled his off.

Well that's all i can think of to type as of now. The good, the bad, and the loud. I do not think i would consider Goose a "misprint", as he is not a face grabber or anything like that nor does he scream incessantly. If i walk out of the room he is silent and if i walk into the room and stay more than 10-15minutes he quiets down. He is just not the perfect imprint i hoped to raise first time around. Hopefully someone out there will learn from my mistakes!

kimmerar
07-05-2007, 08:46 PM
Thanks Noah for all the time you put into this topic. Especially your last post. Takes alot to admit mistakes. It will help me someday. Now I want to hear from other people on what can be done now to help with the screaming and biting. I'm sure someone here might have an answer or idea.

Thanks again - falconry is - I'm sure - always a learning experience.

everetkhorton
07-05-2007, 10:05 PM
Noah:
Thanks for the post, no every body tell's you what they did wrong. Everyone will learn from your experance. A person learns just as much from a mistake and anything else. Maybe some of the bad thing will go away in time. Also sorry about the sloppy CL-2 post I was pulled away with out checking it before I sent it.

Shortwingn
07-06-2007, 09:50 AM
Noah,
For your first imprint you did a fantastic job! For most, including myself the first few imprints are nightmares. Anyone who makes a perfect imprint the first time around is a liar. I think the problems you are having with Goose will all go away with time. I hope I am around to see or hear about your imprints later in life.

`Chris L.
07-06-2007, 01:55 PM
Noah,
great post!! It really says a ton about waht type of person you are. Thank you for sharing that. Your thread has helped many... Keep it up and dont get down, those things may work themselves out.. please keep us posted

Saluqi
07-06-2007, 02:40 PM
Noah,

Nice post, don't beat yourself up, just knowing what the problems are is the first step to correcting them. As far as screaming goes, I've heard indirectly through folks at the Peregrine Fund that some falcons just naturally scream, birds raised in isolation from humans, some in the brood will be totally silent while others are habitual screamers.


...Now I want to hear from other people on what can be done now to help with the screaming and biting. I'm sure someone here might have an answer or idea.


In terms of getting rid of screaming and biting, I'd bet you could train that away using some operant conditioning techniques. Basically you could train for an "incompatible behavior", a behavior that the bird would do, like looking away from you, where it would be impossible for him to bite to you at the same time, or put the biting/screaming on cue. In order to do this you have to be willing to tidbit him by hand.

Here's an email by Steve Layman:

"I had 3 imprint gyrs that I rewarded screaming. They were already
screaming when I got them so more screaming was not going to be much
more of a problem. It was mind numbing nuts in our house!!! They were
destined for a breeding project in England and were not going to be
flown. SO....I decided to do an experiment. I put screaming on cue
(both hands and arms held high above my head) and in not so long a time
their screaming subsided when not in the presents of the cue. BUT,
all I or anyone else had to do was raise their arms above the head like
a conductor and you could strike up the band. I got the idea form one
of Karen Pryor's writings about dolphins... put an undesirable behavior on
cue and then don't give the cue. Karen asked me to bring these falcons
to one of her seminars that was held in Seattle to demonstrate how
clicker training could be used with falcons. She got to see my singing
falcon act.

As for screaming.....
I'm now rewarding screaming in my accipiters. I have done it now with
two. A female coopers a few years ago when the idea occurred to me and
now with an imprint male gos that I'm flying. As you might expect it is
an easy behavior to reward but why you might ask would I do it? I have
found that when an accipiter is in the screaming mind set they are more
social which allows me the opportunity to select and reward subtle
social behaviors that I would otherwise not see. Also, when in that
juvenile mind set they are not as prone to become fearful when exposed
to new surroundings. They are playful when in that state of mind and I
get to have more fun interacting with them and it doesn't stop with
hard penning. My male gos is now 3 years old and the tamest and most
interactive gos I have yet flown. Surprisingly, as he matured I had to
consciously work to maintain his food begging vocalizations and along
with it his juvenile mind set. I have found that it is a wonderful
state of mind for the both of us.. I do have to put up with some
vocalizations but I can turn it on and off to a degree. I have a
playful baby like male goshawk nearly all the time. He doesn't scream
when out hunting and I reserve our close and noisy family relationship
for when we are playing physical conditioning shaping games. The
quickest way I have found to reduce screaming is to reward the simple
act of looking away. Like the emotion aggression, screaming and no eye
contact seem to be incompatible. When looking away from me other
things happen like game flushing...a hunting emotional state is
incompatible with aggression and screaming. And yes, he does hunt.


Steve Layman"

Falcon Boy
07-06-2007, 06:36 PM
Thanks for the posts everyone. I was waiting for the "i told you so" and "you're a moron" and was suprised when i didn't get them on either forum i posted on LOL.

I may have spoken too soon yesterday though, at least in some aspects, as outside today he was much better. As soon as we got outside he shut up and flew 50-60ft to lure instantly. Weight was 28.7oz. He ate instantly and only mantled for about 10 seconds. Perhaps it is just boredom from being inside which causes the screaming? I keep meaning to move him down to the mew but i have to spray a ton of weeds around it first to create a path. It got overgrown a bit without a bird in there.

Jimmy
07-06-2007, 10:17 PM
I told you so, you moron!! [smilie=banana.gif] [smilie=smileys13.gif]

Falcon Boy
07-07-2007, 02:15 PM
Thanks! [smilie=icon_thumright.gif]

gabboon
07-07-2007, 05:02 PM
I told you so, you moron!! [smilie=banana.gif] [smilie=smileys13.gif]

yeah, what Jimmy said!

Better keep that thing out of my town. If there is a scream I can't stand it is from any of the pointy winged things. Something about them really grates my nerves.

You're smart enough you'll work it out. Bring him to the campout either way. We'll perch him next to the eagle owl. I bet that will quiet him.

Falcon Boy
07-08-2007, 07:04 AM
LOL it'd probably make him louder as he bates away [smilie=BangHead.gif]

gabboon
07-08-2007, 10:52 AM
LOL it'd probably make him louder as he bates away [smilie=BangHead.gif]

You'd be surprised. Nothing makes noise next to that owl. He will suddenly realize what it means to feel like lunch and will be very quiet.

Falcon Boy
07-11-2007, 04:56 PM
Didn't weigh Goose today as i'm still keeping him pretty much fat and happy. His weight has been 29-30oz the past few days. He is coming 80ft [length of my creance] instanly to the lure. He keeps taking off the perch when i get about 20ft away... i'm pretty sure he'd circle around if i were out in NM. As soon as i whistle and toss the lure he hits it like a rock. Today he hit it so hard he rolled over afterwards. His footing is improving, i swing the lure so that he sees it as he would in the field and as soon as he is in the air i take off running. I don't stop until i see he has a very secure grip and then i jerk the lure around like a rabbit would if he were to catch it. Goose is very fast... as i said today he flipped over after hitting the lure because he was going so fast. He is definatly faster than any redtail i've had. I can't wait to get him into the field.

He is crap on his tail though and his manners on the lure are bad. He screams, bates away, etc. It takes about 5 min for him to calm down and eat.

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/78.07005.jpg

Jimmy
07-11-2007, 05:36 PM
his manners on the lure are bad. He screams, bates away, etc. It takes about 5 min for him to calm down and eat.

That's just being fat..........

Falcon Boy
07-11-2007, 05:44 PM
That's what i'm hoping!

Falcon Boy
07-18-2007, 05:23 PM
29.3oz today. I have been feeding Goose off the lure everyday, still flying the length of the creance everyday. I have made lure flying harder for him, in that i make him miss the lure 5-6 times before i let him have it. As soon as i pull it out he starts coming and i take off running. Right when he reaches his feet out to grab it i snatch it so he can't get it. Then i take off another direction and he pursues, and we repeat this 5-6 times full speed until he grabs it and i mean really grabs it. Just because he has a foot on it doesn't mean i stop. Once he really grabs it i jerk it around to simulate a struggle and i keep moving for a bit just like a rabbit would, then i let him calm down and eat. He is screaming on the lure less time before eating each day, which is nice, and he is also eating faster instead of just dinking around. After eating all his food though he ran around in a circle looking for more [as per his norm]. He saw the doxie and footed him, luckily i was right there and got him off. Then he hopped up onto the glove and we called it a day. On the way back to the mew the bird tried to foot me too while i was feeling his keel, i guess he was just in a pissy mood today.

I was able to hood him without issue today before the feeding No biting the hood nor footing.

everetkhorton
07-18-2007, 07:56 PM
Noah:
It should not be long now.

Falcon Boy
07-18-2007, 11:31 PM
2-3 weeks now... august 10 seems so far away!

Falcon Boy
07-20-2007, 06:33 PM
Goose was at 29.8oz this morning. I did a dragged bunny for him and he came instantly off the perch. I made him miss one too many times [stupid, in hindsight first time should have just been having the bunny on the ground] and he sat down on the ground. I stopped pulling and he hoped over and ate the skinned chick i had tied to the rabbits neck. The good news is he came instantly, the badnews is i might have killed his confidence a bit. For the next few days i will make the flights on the dragged rabbit easy as confidence boosters. I traded him off to the lure, which he went to instantly and without trying to drag the rabbit.

We also went to the vet today for his health certificate which i need for my NM import permit. He was nice and screamed basically the whole time, what a joy. I had hooded him for the ride, but he flipped out and got the hood off. I am able to get the hood on without much fuss but once the braces are stricken he flips out. I think for the next few days i will hood him for 5-10seconds, then have him leave the fist/perch immediatly after hooding for the rabbit. Hopefully that will create a positive reinforcement towards the hood.

Jimmy
07-20-2007, 08:52 PM
The good news is he came instantly, the badnews is i might have killed his confidence a bit. For the next few days i will make the flights on the dragged rabbit easy as confidence boosters.

I doubt you caused any harm, Noah. He's gotta learn sometime. It's gonna happen when you start hunting him anyway........ If you continue to make them easy, what do you think is gonna happen the first time he gets juked by the real thing?

outhawkn
07-21-2007, 02:08 PM
Goose was at 29.8oz this morning. I did a dragged bunny for him and he came instantly off the perch. I made him miss one too many times [stupid, in hindsight first time should have just been having the bunny on the ground] and he sat down on the ground. I stopped pulling and he hoped over and ate the skinned chick i had tied to the rabbits neck. The good news is he came instantly, the badnews is i might have killed his confidence a bit. For the next few days i will make the flights on the dragged rabbit easy as confidence boosters. I traded him off to the lure, which he went to instantly and without trying to drag the rabbit.

We also went to the vet today for his health certificate which i need for my NM import permit. He was nice and screamed basically the whole time, what a joy. I had hooded him for the ride, but he flipped out and got the hood off. I am able to get the hood on without much fuss but once the braces are stricken he flips out. I think for the next few days i will hood him for 5-10seconds, then have him leave the fist/perch immediatly after hooding for the rabbit. Hopefully that will create a positive reinforcement towards the hood.

Noah,
Try hooding him 10-20 times a day,but dont strike the braces at all. The next day do the same, but slightly pull the braces, next day do the same but pull the braces alittle more. Keep going for a week or so and eventually close them. Are you sure the hood fits properly? If its to small most birds will "flip out". Maybe try a larger hood even. Its also my opinion that while blocked hoods look nice, Anglo-Indian fit the birds better,hawks as well as falcons. Often a bird that objects to the hood will accept an Anglo hood much easier. Just something for you to think about.

Saluqi
07-24-2007, 11:26 AM
We also went to the vet today for his health certificate which i need for my NM import permit. He was nice and screamed basically the whole time, what a joy. I had hooded him for the ride, but he flipped out and got the hood off. I am able to get the hood on without much fuss but once the braces are stricken he flips out. I think for the next few days i will hood him for 5-10seconds, then have him leave the fist/perch immediatly after hooding for the rabbit. Hopefully that will create a positive reinforcement towards the hood.

Noah,
Try hooding him 10-20 times a day,but dont strike the braces at all. The next day do the same, but slightly pull the braces, next day do the same but pull the braces alittle more. Keep going for a week or so and eventually close them. Are you sure the hood fits properly? If its to small most birds will "flip out". Maybe try a larger hood even. Its also my opinion that while blocked hoods look nice, Anglo-Indian fit the birds better,hawks as well as falcons. Often a bird that objects to the hood will accept an Anglo hood much easier. Just something for you to think about.

I've got to agree with Bill, it sounds like your hood may not be fitting properly. Try putting a zip tie on one of the braces so that it when you pull the braces the hood does not fully close. Try this at a couple of different positions each a little tighter than the previous setting and see if there is a point at which he begins to freak out. You could have a very long drive here if your bird is whackin' out the entire way. I could throw together a glue up hood for you and get it in the mail before you hit the road as little welcome to NM gift.

Paul

`Chris L.
07-24-2007, 02:55 PM
I could throw together a glue up hood for you and get it in the mail before you hit the road as little welcome to NM gift.

Paul

Its great to see fellow falconers willing to help out each other.. A lot of that is lost these days. It is refreshing for sure. [smilie=icon_thumright.gif]

Falcon Boy
07-24-2007, 03:19 PM
Bill- I started doing that the day you posted it. He is getting a little better, i can get it on without dodging. The problem i have now is he continues to scream once it is on, but i think that is becuase he can see out of the beak opening a bit on the hood i've been using. I'll try a smaller one tomarrow.

Paul- Thanks for the offer. I have one more hood to try that will be close to fitting. If it doesn't fit, i'll pop you a PM. What sucks is i had bought size 6.5,7,8, and 8.5 b/c thats what i was told he would wear. Funny thing is he is up around a 10 or 11 now. Go figure...

A little update, i've been doing the dragged rabbit everyday. Today he slammed the crap out of it! Double bound to it's face and hung on for dear life. I have been hiding the rabbit in the bushes then dragging it out, so he's getting the idea i think. Can't wait to get him over game [smilie=icon_pidu.gif]

outhawkn
07-24-2007, 05:58 PM
We also went to the vet today for his health certificate which i need for my NM import permit. He was nice and screamed basically the whole time, what a joy. I had hooded him for the ride, but he flipped out and got the hood off. I am able to get the hood on without much fuss but once the braces are stricken he flips out. I think for the next few days i will hood him for 5-10seconds, then have him leave the fist/perch immediatly after hooding for the rabbit. Hopefully that will create a positive reinforcement towards the hood.

Noah,
Try hooding him 10-20 times a day,but dont strike the braces at all. The next day do the same, but slightly pull the braces, next day do the same but pull the braces alittle more. Keep going for a week or so and eventually close them. Are you sure the hood fits properly? If its to small most birds will "flip out". Maybe try a larger hood even. Its also my opinion that while blocked hoods look nice, Anglo-Indian fit the birds better,hawks as well as falcons. Often a bird that objects to the hood will accept an Anglo hood much easier. Just something for you to think about.

I've got to agree with Bill, it sounds like your hood may not be fitting properly. Try putting a zip tie on one of the braces so that it when you pull the braces the hood does not fully close. Try this at a couple of different positions each a little tighter than the previous setting and see if there is a point at which he begins to freak out.

Paul

Paul,

Thats a great idea. I wouldnt have thought of that.

Saluqi
07-25-2007, 10:50 AM
Paul- Thanks for the offer. I have one more hood to try that will be close to fitting. If it doesn't fit, i'll pop you a PM. What sucks is i had bought size 6.5,7,8, and 8.5 b/c thats what i was told he would wear. Funny thing is he is up around a 10 or 11 now. Go figure...

A little update, i've been doing the dragged rabbit everyday. Today he slammed the crap out of it! Double bound to it's face and hung on for dear life. I have been hiding the rabbit in the bushes then dragging it out, so he's getting the idea i think. Can't wait to get him over game [smilie=icon_pidu.gif]

Do you know, are these Rollin's sized hoods? If they are, then a 10 should fit but in my experience a lot of the hood fit is determined by the cut of the beak opening. Let me know soon if you need the hood.

That's cool about the dragged rabbit.

Paul

Falcon Boy
08-04-2007, 04:06 PM
Still flying Goose to the lure daily, and the dragged rabbit everyday or every other day. He smashes both with wreckless abandon. His weight got low [i had been lowering it slowly to try and stop screaming on the lure] so i'm fattening him back up. I ordered my transmitter today so hopefully it will be here by the time i leave, if not i will have to have my parents forward it to my new address at school. I have given up for now on the hood. He did well until today, and it just did not go well. He preferred to pretend he was a bat rather than take the hood. He also freaked out once the braces were drawn. The hooding issues today created him being mad at my free hand again [OH JOY!] but it's not as bad as it was and should pass. I tried putting him in the giant hood as it was my last glimmer of hope for my trip to NM.... and he was perfect, thank goodness.


Here is a picture of Goose on his new perch, courtesy of gabboon and the spike is from Chris L. Thanks to both of you!

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/84.07002.jpg

gabboon
08-04-2007, 06:46 PM
block looks much better under your bird than on my book case. Enjoy! And be sure to send lots of photos from NM.

wesleyc6
08-04-2007, 10:13 PM
He looks very nice Noah! Glad some of the issues have presented answers.

What a beautiful block. I am not going to show Utah, because I don't want him to be all jealous!

`Chris L.
08-04-2007, 10:39 PM
Here is a picture of Goose on his new perch, courtesy of gabboon and the spike is from Chris L. Thanks to both of you!



So the spike fit? Man I was just guessing at the size of bolt to weld on there. Goose looks great and I am glad the spike worked out for you. As I said to you in the PM if you need a biig bolt welded on send it back and I will hook you up [smilie=icon_thumright.gif]

Falcon Boy
08-04-2007, 11:39 PM
The block is by far the best looking perch i've seen. I used to not understand why people would spend 200-300$ on a block... now i do. Steve i owe you many thanks!

Chris ill send you a PM back about the spike.

Wes- Like i said i've never seen a point to expensive blocks till now. I feel very lucky to be given the perch by Steve. This is one of my other blocks, it is portable and of a different style

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/84.07001.jpg

Falcon Boy
08-15-2007, 11:29 PM
I havnt had time to catch up on NAFEX yet, but tomarrow we are taking goose hunting for the first time after jacks and CT"s hopefully. I'll post how it goes :)

Falcon Boy
08-17-2007, 12:48 AM
So i took Goose hunting for the first time today with Bob [local falconer] after some black tailed jacks. It started off by Goose breaking the scale [what a pleasure] but i decided to go anyways as i knew he should be at weight.
So we get to the field we think there will be jacks in and decide to drive till we find one. We see one dash across the road so i grab the Gooser and off we go. Within 30ft Gooser dashes off the fist after the jack full bore! He chased about 100yrds than stooped and missed in the knee to waist high brush. I couldn't tell if he missed or got a foot on it but by the time i got near he was back in the air after it again for another ~150 yard chase [all into the wind]. He stooped again and just missed! He got up a third time, made a few circles, and then put in one final stoop. After missing he stayed on the ground. I swung the lure but no bird. As i started back to the truck I gave the lure to Bob who kept swinging it and halfway back Gooser comes screaming in to the lure. Picked him up perfectly and off we go looking for more, not bad for the first time seeing a jack!
We get back to the car and decide to keep Goose on the fist in case we see anymore dash across the road. About 75yrds down we see the second jack and so i get out and start walking, Goose held up high. He soon see's the jack and puts in a good 100yrd flight upwind, just missing again. He does a few circles about 50ft up looking for the jack, see's it and puts in a final stoop. Missing again and out of breath, i find him and call him to the lure.
The third flight takes about 250yrds down the road and Gooser goes out after the jack. He puts in a good 75yard flight before taking a stoop and missing. By this time he is exhausted so i bring him back to the truck and we decide to look in cover that isn't so heavy.
Our final flight was actually an accident. Gooser flew out the window on a bate and then took off after some mourning doves. by the way we were going about 10mph on a two track. He was too tired to overhaul them, so he just made some 100yard circles around the truck, eventually making a half ass stoop looking thing over near a fence. Upon closer inspection i found a cottontail hiding about 20ft away, whether it was a stoop or not, i don't know. Once he was back in the air i called him into the lure and we were finished for the day.
So now Goose has gone almost full circle. He is a 100% imprint and is now chasing black tailed jacks. A bit of experiance and fitness and he should be smashing them i hope! By the way, he is now almost silent. He screams pretty much in the mew only. In the field and truck he is silent. In the mew he only makes noise upon your approach, then shuts up. All we need to do is start hooking onto these jacks and we are golden! Here are some pics of today, and one pic of NM on the drive in.
Hope everyone is doing well!

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/firsthunt001.jpg

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/firsthunt002.jpg

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/firsthunt004.jpg

everetkhorton
08-17-2007, 07:32 AM
Noah:
Great account of the hunt. What is the blue band for? Nice looking country.

Jimmy
08-17-2007, 08:43 AM
Good deal, Noah!
Give em hell man!!!

wesleyc6
08-17-2007, 10:11 AM
Sounds great! Look at the feet on that bird!

`Chris L.
08-17-2007, 10:35 AM
Noah, [smilie=eusa_clap.gif] .. man that is great to hear. I am sure you will get him dialed in. What a great day for you.

Saluqi
08-17-2007, 11:13 AM
Right on Noah!! Now you need to stop by and visit with Dutch Salmon and pick up a sighthound and you'll have a team.

Paul

Falcon Boy
08-17-2007, 11:15 AM
The blue band is a breeder band and since it wasn't hurting anything i never felt the need to take it off. We are hitting the field again today, but somewhere much more open, as in it's just grasses that are about knee high. The rancher says he sees a lot of jacks, but usually at night. We will see what happens i guess!

hawkstir
08-17-2007, 12:08 PM
Sounds like your in for lots of fun. A lot different than hawk'n in the east.

raptrlvr
08-17-2007, 03:15 PM
Congrats on the first free flight with Goose. It sounds like it went well. Get those jacks moving for me and my eagle. Hey Paul, what happened with that bill to fix all the dogs in NM. I heard that they wanted to spay or nueter all the cats and dogs and that a lot of the hunting dog stock would be affected. Hope it didn't pass.

chamokane
08-17-2007, 03:17 PM
Sounds like a great first day.

Falcon Boy
08-17-2007, 03:24 PM
stay tuned, day two update when i get back from hawking in 8-10hrs [smilie=icon_thumright.gif]

Falcon Boy
08-17-2007, 08:21 PM
The day was kinda grey and i knew rain was coming, but i decided to head out anyways. I got 15min out of town to the gas station, and it started dumping so i turned around and came back to the dorm. I am going to go tomarrow morning to the alfalfa fields as the sun comes up.

Falcon Boy
08-18-2007, 11:45 AM
Well i took Goose out right at sunrise today. First of all, in the morning there are a lot more rabbits. Jim, we will not have trouble finding game for your eagle if this keeps up.

Anyways the first flight i went to the alfalfa fields and didn't find anything. Gooser went up and started to mount up a bit, then after 5min or so he went and goofed off about 100yrds away flying low to the ground. Here is a vid of right after he took off.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=w4ad4uHsvFY

After that i called him down and went 1/2 mile down the road to where i saw lots of jacks on the sides of the road. I found 2 Jacks 5ft off the road and they stayed right next to the truck as i got Goose out... and he decided he would play batbird. Since he wasn't going to sit on the fist i just let him go and the jacks took off and he paid no attention. He spent some time goofing off about 200yrds away then bolted about 400yrds away. I lost sight of him so i pulled out the telem. I heard a beep so i walked a bit into the field and started hearing the telem getting louder. He was appearntly sitting on the ground about 500yrds away but came as soon as i called. It took about 10min to find him after he took off. Talk about scary stuff...

Anyway i didn't really plan on flying him again, but i saw a jack slinking away so i decided to risk it. I kept him on the fist and he didn't really pay attention. Back towards the road i flushed a cottontail and he head bobbed, but then didn't take off. A bit of encouragement [aka a nice little toss] and goose chased with about 1/2 effort for about 100yrds, then landed on the ground when the bunny went into a hole.

After that i put Gooser away because he was pretty cropped up. I think he didn't fly well for a few reasons- 1) he wasn't particularly hungry, as i fed him a bit yesterday night 2) he had never flown in the morning, and 3) he hadn't cast yet. I plan on flying him in the mornings from now on since there are so many more rabbits out, plus i kinda like being up instead of sleeping half the day away. I can't fly him again till tuesday though as he will be too heavy tomarrow and monday i have class in the morning.

chamokane
08-18-2007, 03:37 PM
Some of the best flights I've seen have been just as the sun was coming up, but you're right, the bird needs to be used to flying at that time of day.

Falcon Boy
08-21-2007, 11:36 AM
time- Too early
weight- ~25oz
third hunt

Well i saw a lot of rabbits on the way in today and i was a bit earlier than last time so i was hoping for the best. Unforunatly Goose decided not to chase today, but i found a roadkill rabbit [fresh of course] and i dragged that at the end and let him have a pretty good crop. Hopefully that will remind him that things with big ears are food. In an hour and half i probably flushed close to 20-30 rabbits, CT's and jacks.

here is gooser on the dragged jack.

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/3rdhunt001.jpg

Jimmy
08-21-2007, 01:45 PM
Hey Noah, has he been at a different weight than the first time when he chased? I wish I could see 30 rabbits a year, and you see 'em in an hour....damn you!

Falcon Boy
08-21-2007, 01:47 PM
The bird broke the scale the day before the first hunt, so i am not exactly sure what his weight was that first day. I'm thinking its a combo of weight and getting used to being flown first thing in the morning. Back in MD i would always feed him in the afternoon and 2-3 days ago i started the morning stuff.

Falcon Boy
08-23-2007, 11:48 AM
Again out before dawn and again nothing to show for it. His weight was a bit higher than last time but not too much. His first flight was roughly 5-10min. After that the length before he landed decreased with each flight. He did have one very strong flight off the glove where he went after something about 1/2mile away but he came back to the lure right away afterwards.

We did have two very good flights, one after a coopers hawk and one after a songbird, both accidental but good flying nonetheless. He also put in one stoop on a jack meandering down the train tracks but nothing noteworthy.

We were visited by the local birds again, which I'm now going to name since i see the same birds every time. The two prairies are from here on going to be known as the twins, the three swainson's will be the triplets and the hag female RT will be Gretchen. Why did i name them? Because i had nothing better to do while goose was sitting on the ground. ::)

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/4thhunt004.jpg

http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/4thhunt006.jpg


And who says the desert can't be beautiful?
http://i74.photobucket.com/albums/i278/apprenticefalconry2/4thhunt001.jpg

Rudd
08-23-2007, 12:08 PM
Very nice pictures. The desert is a beautiful place, sometimes.

outhawkn
08-23-2007, 12:54 PM
I'm still jealous!

Jimmy
08-23-2007, 01:15 PM
Beautiful scenery......

everetkhorton
08-23-2007, 01:38 PM
Noah:
How hot does it get there, it looks green?

hawkstir
08-23-2007, 01:50 PM
Those pictures bring back memories of when I was stationed out there in the service. Hot during the day and cold at night.

Falcon Boy
08-23-2007, 01:59 PM
Noah:
How hot does it get there, it looks green?

It's been getting up to about 85-90 during the day. The past week we've had lots of cloud cover coming in at night as well as rain.

sharptail
08-23-2007, 10:43 PM
I'm still jealous!

After all this time, still jealous! Welcome back!

kimmerar
08-23-2007, 10:53 PM
Welcome back Bill - how about an update on yours??

chamokane
08-24-2007, 11:47 AM
I'm still jealous!

Hi Bill. [smilie=smileys13.gif]

outhawkn
08-24-2007, 02:02 PM
Jeff,Kim,and Dave

Hello guys and Thanks,
Bill

wesleyc6
08-24-2007, 05:01 PM
Same here Bill. Glad you are back!

Falcon Boy
08-25-2007, 02:43 PM
Woke up at 5am to see a monsterous thunderstorm off in the distance but i decided to try and go anyways. 40miles outside town and about 15miles from the hunting grounds it started pouring so i came back to the dorms and went back to sleep for an hour.

I woke up again around 845 and was out the door by 9. I got to the field around 10 and put Gooser up. He flew well, the best i've seen yet. His first flight was probably 15minutes or so, his longest yet. I could tell he was starting to get tired and i called him in before he landed. He did have an amazing flight after i THINK a jack making 3-4 stoops on it but i was 125yrds downwind and couldn't see what he was chasing. His highest point was roughly 300ft, average about 200.

His second flight was about 10minutes and he chased 2 or 3 little birds VERY hard, to the point of crashing brush after them. After this flight i called him in to a dragged rabbit, which he saw from 400yrds away and hit before i could get the line out. I dragged him and the rabbit about 40yards to simulate a struggle then he immediatly broke into the head. I picked him up with a piece of jack and we moved on.

On his third flight he launched off the fist in the oppisite direction of the jack 20yrds ahead.... frustrating to say the least. He flew well for 5min or so then went and sat on the traintracks [his favorite place to sit, if i ever loose him i know where to look first]. I flashed the lure and he came back over head, after his second circle around me i called him down again. His fourth flight he went to go sit again so i called it a day.

Falcon Boy
08-26-2007, 11:52 AM
Flew Goose again today. Went up to about 400ft up but spent alot of time goofing off 400yrds+ away from me. He had what must have been the easiest slip ever. I was swinging the lure and a jack walked up to me. I mean walked within 3ft of me while swinging the lure. When goose was on his way, he just flew past. To say i was disappointed is an understatement. Total airtime about 45min

gabboon
08-26-2007, 12:16 PM
then went and sat on the traintracks [his favorite place to sit, if i ever loose him i know where to look first].

be wary of trains. A friend told me of one of his hawks taking a perch on a train. That started moving. And it couldn't hear him calling over the noise. His hawk was headed out of town as the train picked up speed. I forget how it ended, but the hawk left its perch before getting too far away.

Jimmy
08-26-2007, 02:04 PM
He had what must have been the easiest slip ever.

Live baggy time???

outhawkn
08-26-2007, 04:08 PM
Same here Bill. Glad you are back!

Thanks Wes!

Noah, I think Jimmy is trying to give you a HINT. And I hate to admit this but I agree with him [smilie=eusa_boohoo.gif] . [smilie=smileys13.gif]

Falcon Boy
08-26-2007, 04:26 PM
I think you guys are right, time to pull out the .22 [smilie=icon_pidu.gif]

Jimmy
08-26-2007, 06:51 PM
Don't shoot the bird, Noah..... [smilie=eusa_doh.gif]
Things will improve sooner or later........ [smilie=eusa_think.gif]

everetkhorton
08-26-2007, 06:53 PM
I think you guys are right, time to pull out the .22 [smilie=icon_pidu.gif]

Noah
Anyway of live traping Jack's

Falcon Boy
08-26-2007, 07:09 PM
Don't shoot the bird, Noah..... [smilie=eusa_doh.gif]
Things will improve sooner or later........ [smilie=eusa_think.gif]

i'll avoid that [smilie=smileys13.gif]


Ev- if there is a way to live trap a jack i don't know about it.

wesleyc6
08-27-2007, 08:16 AM
If you can call the jacks up with a lure in NM, I would recommend you keep doing that and use a dip net. [smilie=eusa_doh.gif]

everetkhorton
08-27-2007, 12:16 PM
Don't shoot the bird, Noah..... [smilie=eusa_doh.gif]
Things will improve sooner or later........ [smilie=eusa_think.gif]

i'll avoid that [smilie=smileys13.gif]


Ev- if there is a way to live trap a jack i don't know about it.

Noah:
One way to catch a jack is hide behind sage brush and sound like a carrett. [smilie=icon_thumright.gif] In Mi. we hide behind a tree and sound like a nut to catch sqr. [smilie=bs.gif]

hawkstir
08-27-2007, 01:16 PM
EV, you already sound like a nut. You don't have to stand behind a tree to do it. LOL [smilie=smileys13.gif]

everetkhorton
08-27-2007, 02:16 PM
Fred
Maybe an acorn but not a full nut, yet. [smilie=icon_pray.gif]