KC's Log

[hawkstir]

Hi. My name is KC. My falconer Hawkstir says I weighed in at 131g. last Saturday when he birdnapped me.
http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c397/hawkstir/100_0064.jpg
The following pictures are of my new home for the next couple of weeks.
http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c397/hawkstir/100_0067.jpg
http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c397/hawkstir/100_0069.jpg
http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c397/hawkstir/100_0068.jpg
Today I weighed 135g at 5:45am, that's just before riding to work with my falconer. I'm hanging out watching him work and meeting lots of new humans. Funny creatures they are. Well got to go. Bye
http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c397/hawkstir/100_0065.jpg
PS. I sure hope he finds me something to kill.

[Jimmy]

Great stuff, Fred!!! [smilie=eusa_clap.gif] [smilie=eusa_clap.gif]
Looking forward to watching the progress!! [smilie=icon_thumright.gif]

[gabboon]

k

[`Chris L.]

Fred,
great log. I really look forward to the progress... thank you for taking the time to do it [smilie=eusa_clap.gif]

[everetkhorton]

Fred:
Great to see another spec of bird being raised. Fun to compaire. I have never seen eyes birds at this stage before. Thanks for the posting.

[hawkstir]

KC here. Yesterday afternoon a small bird invaded my box. I chased it until I could pin it down and break into it's head. I eat all but a little bit on each wing and it's legs. YUM, SOO tasty.
Photo removed for discretionary measures.

[everetkhorton]

Fred:
She looks different with every picture. Her feather are sure starting to grow. How old is she now Fred?

[hawkstir]

I'm guessing +or - 3 weeks.

[chamokane]

KC, you are a cute little thing. If you want to ditch Fred, you can come live at my house. [smilie=icon_thumright.gif]

[hawkstir]

I'm trapped, I'm trapped!
I've been very active the last couple of days. Trying real hard to get out of my cardboard nest box. Hawkstir is going to put some anklets and jesses on me and tether me to a bow perch this evening. He'll have to post some pics. I've lost almost all my down, just a little on the wings and barely noticeable on the head.

[goshawks00]

Great posts Fred!! I hope you continue. A good friend of mine in Canada got an imprint downie K bird several years ago wow what a killer he became. Car hawking starlings became his specialty and did in the neighborhood of 140 for the two yeatrs he had him. Unforunately he contracted some type of bug from one of his victims and died.
What type of bird are you feeding in the picture.
Good luck,
Barry

[everetkhorton]

Fred:

Do you put any Vitamin Supplement on your bird food before it eats it?
[smilie=dontknow.gif]

[hawkstir]

Ev

I sprinkle a little Vitahawk on about once a week. I also make sure to feed a verity of different foods. IE DOC, mice & voles, grasshoppers and crickets, sparrow and starling.

Just got back in from a short grasshopper hunt with KC on the glove for a walk. I would catch the hopper and put her on the ground with it in front of her and let her run and try to catch it on her own. They all escaped her, but I recaught most and feed them to her later. She says it's easier in to do in her box.

[hawkstir]

Yeah, I'm bad. [smilie=eusa_naughty.gif]
Hawkstir hooked me with some anklets and jesses.
http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c397/hawkstir/100_0078.jpg
This is were I hang out now. I can watch Hawkstir lay on the couch ,watching TV, or eating, or writing in my logbook, or whatever. Right now I'm watching this spot of light dance around on the wall. It's a reflection off of Hawkstirs watch.
http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c397/hawkstir/100_0079.jpg

[everetkhorton]

KC:

How grown up you look. [smilie=icon_thumright.gif]

[Lee]

She sure has grown since you pulled her.

[hawkstir]

I've started a sort of tame hack. I made sure there were no holes in my mew that she could fit through and free lofted her in there for a couple hours this afternoon. I had a half dozen grasshoppers that I turned loose. She showed some interest but didn't do any chasing at first. Probably needs to get used to the new environment and she's no where near hunting weight. However she did run a little and was able to jump up on my screen perch which is about 2 ft. high. I left her alone for short periods of time while I caught more hoppers and did a few other things, returning to look in her when I past by. I hope to let her in there as much as I can, but I don't feel comfortable enough to leave her unattended for long periods of time or overnight yet.

[everetkhorton]

Fred:
Sounds like everything is going smooth. How does she like the water? I have heard they really like it but I do not know at what age.

[hawkstir]

Update, KC's doing real well.
Her weight is ranging between low 130's to mid 140's. I haven't really dialed it in yet. I'm feeding 15g. daily + grasshoppers. Each day she shows me something new.
Yesterday she made her way up to the high perch by the window in the mew. She also jumped a foot and a half to get a Grasshopper off the glove 3 times. She also ran about 3' on the floor to catch one. All this without any weight reduction. I want her train to finish out a little more before any weight reduction.

[Jimmy]

Hey, Fred.
What's the perching spot on your scales made of?

[hawkstir]

PVC pipe T epoxyed to the scale plate with foam pad wrapped with Vetwrap. I don't usually use red with BOP but it was all I had on hand at the time.

[hawkstir]

I took KC for a walk about yesterday. She climbed up on my hat for the ride. I don't mind her riding there as long as I don't feel something running down the back of my neck. [smilie=eusa_doh.gif] I was hoping to find some hoppers, but it was damp and cool and they weren't cooperative. Later I let her fly free about my garage while I puttered about. She made 1 flight of aprox. 12'. The longest yet. I let feed on some bits attached to her lure.

[goshawks00]

Fred she sounds like she coming along fine. Are you using any telemetry on her? This is the time I've found that it's very important for them to be wearing one, as one flight and she could be in a tree and be way to heavy/ inexperienced to come down/then things begin to escalate. Can you say weather/crows/ coops/ overnights lost etc?? I have an old , in fact really old Luksander single battery Merlin Spec. that years ago had a goshawk strip the antenna wire off. Perfect!!!!, it still gives off a good signal and it's range is about a mile and can be attached with a bewit each morning or in your case when ever you take the 'student' out for lessons. I've used it on every coops/spar/sharpie/goshawk I've raised in the last decade and a half and found it time and again indespensable . It's about as cheap an insurance as you can get for keeping your new charge safe as you can get for now. I think the newer tansmitters with the screw off anteenas would work as well

[hawkstir]

I don't own or use telemetry. I have been thinking of a neck bell on her, but right now all I have are RT bells, probably a bit to large.

[everetkhorton]

Fred: I flew a merlin many years ago. They can hide behind a blade of grass. So small. The merlin was not an imprint but Telemerty would not hurt. JMO I use it on my Rt. and have had to use it more time than I would like to say. I would be up a creek with out a paddle with out it [smilie=icon_hang.gif]

[hawkstir]

Thanks for the advice and concern. Unfortunately it's not in the budget for quite some time to come.

[goshawks00]

Fred possibly you could scrape together enogh money to at least get a transmitter. At least then when you lose her you can get someone to help you find where she went.
Barry

[hawkstir]

Sorry, putting a motor in my truck comes first.

Closest receiver is over an hour away. If he's home.

Falconry was practiced for thousands of years before electronics. I'm sure not their birds where lost.

Thanks again.

[[HOA]hawk]

Nice looking bird can't wait to hear about her first kill!

[goshawks00]

Yep, I don't care how long falconry was practiced before the invention of telemetry it's irresponsible to not use it. Your bird is an imprint you owe it to the bird being that you've changed her life to fit your desires. Waiting an hour for someone to show up is better than losing a bird because it doesn't fit 'your timing'.
Sorry,
barry

[everetkhorton]

Fred:
If you come to the NAFA meet I will gladly loan you one. In fact I do not need mine until around Sept. if you want to use it until then, it is set up for a tail mount. It is one of the real small one, I could send it to you.
Ev.

[kimmerar]

That's awesome Ev. Fred you could not get that from just any forum. I would take him up on that. It will give you some experience with telemetry too.

[hawkstir]

07/05/07
KC weighed 131g this morning and I left 20 g of food on her lure on the floor of the mew where she is free lofted.
When I got home this afternoon all the food was gone and she weighed 134g.
I weighed out another 10g. which she eat a tidbit at a time, after flying to the fist a distance of 5 to 6 ft.. The last and largest portion was fed off the lure that she flew to the same distance.
Overall she is flying with more confidence and landing with good balance.
She only chitters a little, and has never screamed. Hopefully this will continue.
I hope to start slowly lowering her weight this weekend to see if I can improve her response time. I'm a little hesitant to rush this phase because I think her feathers could stand to push out a little more. I'll be able to judge better in a day or two.
07/06/07
She weighed 132g. I'm repeating yesterdays routine.

[hawkstir]

Hello everyone,
Hawkstir has been trying to teach me to fly to the glove for some tiny bits of food but I'm managing to be more stubborn than him.
http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c397/hawkstir/100_0086.jpg
http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c397/hawkstir/100_0085.jpg
I did fly to him a couple of times. It's hard because there are so many new sights to see. I did give in to him when he dropped that funny looking leather bird on the ground under my perch. Funnier yet was that it tasted like mouse. I got a real good dinner off from it though and decided it would be OK to jump up on Hawkstir's glove for dessert.

[everetkhorton]

Fred:
Looking Good! [smilie=sunny.gif]

[`Chris L.]

Fred,
Looks great. The bird has feathered out nicely. [smilie=eusa_clap.gif]

[goshawks00]

We got in a rehab female K bird over the weekend. 133 grams. Close to hard penned and in three days she is coming 20 foot to the fist. A real sweet-heart and in fact our 10 year old granddaughter who is spending the summer is doing all the 'work' with this one and did in fact name her Sweety and is very excited about handling her. We are leaving for four days going to the UP of Mich. and she will spend a lot of car time bonding and handling her. If all goes well we will start hacking this Sunday. This bird came in as an injured eyas which fell out of a tree and was mauled by something, possibly a cat, needing 15 stitches to re-attach a dangling scalp piece. While the sewing went well there is a noticable lack of feathers where the stitching was done and I wonder if that will have much affect come colder weather? May have to tame hack then send south to warmer weather, I have no idea...
Barry

[hawkstir]

125g @ 5:40 am, left 20g DOC on hack board in mew
127g @ 3:40 pm, all of DOC gone, sprayed down with water bottle, drank some.
Set up baggy, KC flew off perch after a few second hesitation, grabbing the bird by the head and plucking at the back of it's neck, lost control once but regained almost at once. After letting her break in, I made in on my hands and knees and handled the kill with each hand while letting her continue to eat. She showed signs of carring and mantled and squacked a little at first, but settled down nicely after a few minutes. Let her eat all she wanted.

Have to start working on dialing in her weight and reinforcing the lure and calling to the glove.
Patience.
Itching to hunt
Patience.........Patience

[goshawks00]

Once they have broken in after the initial adrenaline rush is over and she has managed very well on her own .... she sees you, possible in her eyes... as 'coming sneaking up to her and trying to steal her food'. She is going to get defensive, later aggressive and worse carry.

It's during the heat 'of the battle' while she is putting herself on the line to try and conquer and subdue her food that she may be receptive to any outside help. Even then and especially if she has learned she is capable of 'sealing the deal ' , she may resent you. That is the fine balancing act that many falconers have a hard time learning recognize and yeild to. Let her see you as an allie, not a competitor.

[hawkstir]

Thanks for the advice. I'll make in much sooner on the next one.

[goshawks00]

Don't be surprised if it takes a "few" to get her thinking and looking to you for help. It takes a lot longer to extinguish a bad habit , that to create it.
Barry

[wesleyc6]

I found the kestrels I flew to be the hardest birds to make in on after the kill. All of mine wanted to carry. I have caught quite a few birds with HH's and other birds out the window. I think the kestrels are just so fearful.......and rightly so. Good luck with it and please keep us posted!

[hawkstir]

Yesterdays session went very well. I've got her weight down to 120g and I'm getting real good glove responce out to 15' on the creance. I also gave her a baggy which she hesitated on a little but eventually flew to it and grabbed hold of its throat. I made in and opened it up to expose the breast meat. She offered no opposion and I let her crop up and then popped the head for her and did a vanishing act with the rest. I'm going to keep working her at this weight and get her going a little further on the creance and work on the lure some more also. I'm sure I'll have to drop her weight some more yet before that first free flight.

[everetkhorton]

Fred
Won't be long now. Sounds like things are moving along great
at the moment. Good luck and keep us posted. Any picture of her
flying on the creance?

[hawkstir]

After doing some serious multi tasking and several failed attemps I managed to get this short video of a creance flight.
http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c397/hawkstir/th_c5e1193f.jpg (http://s31.photobucket.com/albums/c397/hawkstir/?action=view&current=c5e1193f.flv)
I also shot a short clip of KC on her lure.
http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c397/hawkstir/th_6ec477c2.jpg (http://s31.photobucket.com/albums/c397/hawkstir/?action=view&current=6ec477c2.flv)

[everetkhorton]

Fred:

Sorry, I could not run the video. I thing I would have to load another
program into my computer. If I can figure how to delete some of the
unwanted program I already have I will load another. My hard drive
is getting full.
Thanks for the post anyway, I know some others can run it.

[hawkstir]

Ev, you should work on that.
Here's a still shot of KC on her lure.
http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c397/hawkstir/100_0104.jpg

[Rudd]

Beautiful girl. Thanks for posting the videos.

[everetkhorton]

Fred:
Nice picture. She looks like she knows what she is doing. The next few
weeks are going to be interesting. Thanks for the picture.

[hawkstir]

When I get home from work I have to walk by the window in the mew. KC will be on the perch at the window and will get very vocal and start jumping around and grabbing the bars. I'm hoping this is a phase she's going through now that she's pretty much hard pinned and I've got her weight figured out to be within a gram or two of 120 when I get home. She seems to respond real well at that weight. When I take her out of the mew and hook her up to the creance she'll quite down. I can get about 1/2 doz. good flights to the glove before the response time falls way off. Last night at that point I pulled out the lure and drug it about in front of her and she came to it within a few seconds. Not super aggressive but better then she had been. Tonight I had a live baggy with a broken wing so I put her on her perch and creance and hid behind a grape arbor for a moment, then pitched the baggy over top out in front of her and she was on it within a second of it hitting the ground. She was wrestling with it when I made in and pinned it down. She then proceeded to throttle it and just about rip it's head off. I let her feed on it until she slowed way down and then transfered her to a leg I had pulled off while she was eating. Other than the vocalizing, which isn't real annoying yet, I think she's coming along quite well. I'm going to have to drop her just a little more and do more creance work, reinforcing the lure, before trying to free fly her.

[everetkhorton]

Fred:

As you know I hunt sqr. with a Rt. I am a real fan of the lure. When Tony Hawk kill a sqr. I make in and dispatch the sqr. so she does not get bit. I let her tear at the sqr. and settle down. Then I pull out the lure and put it just out of her reach and she will jump on it and eat. While she is on the lure I remove the sqr. to my vest. When she is done on the lure she jumps to the fist for a tid-bit. I pick up the lure and we are off. This is just for your
information. Just a different way of doing something.

[kimmerar]

I use the leg to trade off. Works great in the field and you can trade off after trading off the kill with just one or two little bites by pulling the leg through your fingers and then she thinks she's done and you're off for another flight.

I really recommend getting her to practice flying back to you through the window of your car if your going to car hawk. I've only trained one bird but that is something I wished I spent more time on and will with my next bird.

[hawkstir]

Hi all, Hawkstir made me this niffty perch. I like it much better than that bowed thing he had me on.

http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c397/hawkstir/100_0106.jpg

He's been cutting back on my rations and getting me to fly to his glove more. I really like it when he pulls out that leather bird looking thing because I get a real meal and not just little bits and pieces.
Sunday 07/22/07 first free flight at 117g.
Yesterday we went out in a field and I got to fly after grasshoppers. I managed to catch three out of six attemps. Then I almost caught the leather bird in the air. (Falconers fault for miss timing the swing) I did grab it after a short ground chase.

[Jimmy]

How do you have the block attached to the bucket, Fred? PVC flange??
The bird is looking good, and sounds like she's progressing nicely.

[hawkstir]

Jimmy, I counterbored the bottom of the block and bored a 6" sq. piece for the bottom. I made two cross cuts in each end of the pvc stand and forced it into the wood. I screwed through the bottom of the plastic base into the bottom piece of wood. The block itself is a short piece of dried Hawthorn from my woodshed. I used a draw knife to peal the bark, then sanded and coated with mineral oil. The daisy mat is applied with Gerrilla Glue.

[Jimmy]

So there's another piece of wood on the bottom, under the gravel? Or is that gravel?
Smart.... [smilie=icon_thumright.gif]

[hawkstir]

Kitty litter

[everetkhorton]

Fred:
She is looking good. Nice set up.

[hawkstir]

Last evening I had KC down to 115g. I took her out for her second free flight. She's still a little vocal on the glove but not as bad as she has been. I walked through the grass but she didn't seem interested in the grass hoppers. I flushed some birds from the bushes and still no interest. After about 15 min. of this she flew off onto a perch about 10 yards off. She flew back to the glove on call, no problem. We moved to a narrow strip of grass and she jumped of after a hopper but didn't catch it. Then back to the glove. Then she jumped off again and I thought it was for another hopper, but instead she flew about 50 yds. into a thick stand of trees. (I could hear Barry saying,"I told you, you should have telemetry.") I could see her and tried to call her back to the glove but she ignored me. Once she flew towards me but circled back into the trees. I then decided to pull out the lure and call her down with that. Well she came and circled it then back to the trees. Second time I let it hit the ground and she took it. I hooked her up and let her eat. I'm going to drop her another gram or two and try again.
I really would like to find some better flushes. Our bird population has seemed to of dried up. I'm out of baggies until this weekend so just tring to make do with what I've got. Hadn't anticipating her free flying quite yet. Made me quite nervious last evening with her in the trees and slow to respond, would of been a great place for a Coopers or similar. I must say her false returns showed some nice flight style though.

[Jimmy]

I knew a well known falconer that flew his Goshawk on a bow fishing reel, and that is no
joke.

The chinese (or maybe it's the japanese?) do it all the time with sparrow hawks. They have little reels mounted to their wrists. That's a traditional way over there...

Hey Fred,
KC is doing great. Can't wait to hear about that first wild kill.

[hawkstir]

KC was at 113g last evening. I waited till after supper when it was a little cooler. Stomped about kicking up hoppers and she showed more interest, diving into the grass a half dozen times, catching one. She also flew after a small butterfly. Great to see a little more aggression out of her. She flew off to other perches a couple times and returned instantly on call. Starting to tidbit every other call. Started to sprinkle and looked like heavy rain coming so I called her to the lure. She came about 15 yards right now but missed an easy shot and sat on the ground squaking. I put her back up and repeated the test, she came again, touched the lure in air, so I let it drop to the ground next to her, she paused then jumped toward it, I dig it away slowly and she started running after it until she latched on with both feet, then I let her feed.
After she was done I took her in and fitted her with a neck bell andlet her get used to. It'll help me locate her in the high grass if needed.

[hawkstir]

Had KC out again last evening. Started out with a English sparrow on my garage roof. Tossed KC up and she perched about 4' from it and looked at it for about 2 min.. Then she ran down the ridge toward it, but when it flew, she just stood there. I called her down and proceeded up through the field behind the house. There was a large flock of Starlings and Grackles working near the top, so I tryed to angle ahead of them in hopes of getting a slip. KC took off about 100 yds. to the trees. As I close to where the flock was they took off in a cloud the wrong way. I called KC down to the glove no problem and walked over by an old abandened barn and kicked about. Flushed a couple somethings but KC showed no interest. It'd be nice if she would at least show a little more aggression, ie: give chase even if she didn't catch. O'well. We started back toward the house and she took off to some trees along the road. There were some Grackles and such working around them, so I work my way down and around them in hopes I'd get them moving and she'd chase from her perch. No luck. The birds bugged out. I called her down to the glove. Then she flew back to the same tree. Called her again. This time she stole the tidbit and went back to the same perch. OK, I moved half again further away and called her down. A little slower but still coming. The birds were still around at the opposite bottom corner so I angled that way and KC flew over toward them. She was soring about with Grackles and tree swallows all around her. She seemed to be enjoying the air time and flying well, but showed no interest in killing. She perched in a tall tree and I waited abit to watch her reactions. After letting her set a couple minutes I tried calling her down and got no responce. I decided it been long enough so I pulled the lure. She repositioned but didn't come. I walked about 50 yds away and swung it again. This time she came but landed short of hitting it. I continued to swing it slowly, just off the ground and she eventually came after it and chased it along the ground until I let her have it.
I'm working her at 113-115g. She's getting quite a bit of air time and flying well, which must be helping her conditioning. I'm going to stay at this weight a little longer and see if there's a change in attitude as she develops more. It's also been hotter then usual, a cold front could change everything.

[kimmerar]

Hey Fred - I'd say drop her a little more. How much weight is she loosing a day. I'm messing around with someone else's imprint right now while they are on vacation. I can't believe how timid this bird is. I've heard that will change. My sponser says he loves lure flying imprint kestrels. You get them airborn chasing that lure and they get very good. Takes a lot of work to get to that. The bird I have is scared of the black lures. Changed to brown and dropped her weight a few grams and she nailed it last night. She paced like she was nervous about it but she finally got the nerve - I left for a few minutes and came back - and hit it immediately.

I love passage kestrels - as of right now!!! I've changed my mind - I don't want to raise and eyass. I'll wait for the sharpy.

[Lee]

Carhawking is a great way to get her started, it provides close easy slips and really helps a bird get going and once she is catching some wild quarry you can try off the fist flights, I have to agreee with Kim it sounds like a bit of a weight issue to me, maybe drop her a gram or two let it stabilize then lower her again in a few days untill you find the response you are looking for.

[hawkstir]

Carhawking is a great way to get her started, it provides close easy slips and really helps a bird get going and once she is catching some wild quarry you can try off the fist flights, I have to agreee with Kim it sounds like a bit of a weight issue to me, maybe drop her a gram or two let it stabilize then lower her again in a few days untill you find the response you are looking for.
My understanding is that carhawking is not legal in PA.
I agree it's a weight issue. I'm going to let her work at this weight and then lower some more in a day or two. I'm afraid if I drop to fast I may miss the mark and go to far. And I really hate playing YO YO with a birds weight.

[hawkstir]

Pretty much just more of the same ol same oh.
She may have put in a chase this morning but can't say for sure. I was on one side of some bushes and some birds flushed and I heard her bell jingle. When I came around she perched in a new location. The neck bell works real well for keeping track of her movements and she's still rather vocal. Also she won't let me go to far without coming to find me.

[hawkstir]

It's been a few days sence I posted here.
I think I may have let her weight drop a little to low. She's been reluctant to want to fly to much. What I call food screaming almost all the time, even when out free flying, robbing the glove when called, real good responce to the lure, [smilie=eusa_doh.gif] . I'm going to raise her back up slowly and now have some starling and quail breast to feed her, so hopefully that'll help. She's been on a DOC diet with an occasional mouse and GH's for a while, I think she needs something a little richer.
She frustrates me sometimes but not to fear, I'll learn what she needs and will adapt. I wish they could just talk. LOL

[everetkhorton]

It's been a few days sence I posted here.
I think I may have let her weight drop a little to low. She's been reluctant to want to fly to much. What I call food screaming almost all the time, even when out free flying, robbing the glove when called, real good responce to the lure, [smilie=eusa_doh.gif] . I'm going to raise her back up slowly and now have some starling and quail breast to feed her, so hopefully that'll help. She's been on a DOC diet with an occasional mouse and GH's for a while, I think she needs something a little richer.
She frustrates me sometimes but not to fear, I'll learn what she needs and will adapt. I wish they could just talk. LOL

Fred:
What do you think KC would say, if she could talk? I think it would be
much harder to get a K-bird to catch birds when they eat so many bugs etc. Birds are natural food for a SSHA.
I have to give creidt to anyone that can fly those small birds, my hats off
to you. [smilie=icon_thumright.gif]

[wesleyc6]

Hey Fred,
Do you mind sharing about how much food she eats a day? I am just curious. Not wanting to fly and robbing can be signs of her being close to weight also but not just quite low enough. It always made me nervous finding the right weight on a kestrel. I remember one that I flew would kill small birds at like 84g(and carry too) and at 83 g he would catch starling and at 82g he would come back in the window. AT 83 g he would come to the glove fine, but not in the window and one gram higher and he would buzz the glove or snatch and run. Then the imprinting makes it even harder to find weight. LOL. If it makes you feel better, I am in that weight searching mode to with my falcon.

[hawkstir]

Ev,
I think she would tell me about all my short comings as a falconer. About how sometimes I dis-reguard the little details or take short cuts due to my own agenda. Things that I'm sure we all have done at times. The same things that can make a difference between a so so falconer and a good falconer.

Wes,
I feed her 10g in the morning, she weights in at around 125g. Then I check her when I get home from work in the middle afternoon. She's usually at 120g or a little lower. While flying she gets 20g between her tidbits and lure garnish. I flew her at 116g one night and she would fly to me and huddle between my feet. Reluctant to jump up to the glove. Another factor which I believe is troubling me is the extreme heat we've been having here this last week. I'm not sure how to adjust for that. I've tried giving her a couple tidbits and squirting her with water when I get home and then fly her later in the evening when it's cooler. She does fly better but still has the same behaviors.

[`Chris L.]

If it makes you feel better, I am in that weight searching mode to with my falcon.

I am about to feel the pain of that as well. Oh it should be fun.. Fred, great job on her. keep us posted

[wesleyc6]

I found that my kestrels didn't do well with feeding twice a day. Could just be my experience. Some like 22 hour weight control and some don't, but this is one thing I can say with what I think is authority. If you only feed once a day and you have the same amount of time in between feeding each day, hunger won't vary as much. You can have a bird at weight, but has only gone 5 hours without food and they will behave differently than a bird that has been 22 hours without food and they are at weight. Also, with a kestrel it seems to me that they get a large crop because of their good food burn if you feed once a day. When feeding twice a day and maintaining weight, they don't ever really get much of a crop.

Heat and humidity really stink when getting out with eyasses. I have often seen my falcon come in to the lure like a banshee and sit on it and pant for 10 minutes while I cooked sitting by the lure.

Fred, I am just sharing some of my experiences with you. I hope I don't aggravate you with it. If so, just say the word and I will read silently. [smilie=sleepy2.gif] [smilie=icon_hang.gif] [smilie=icon_hang.gif]

[hawkstir]

Wes,
I don't mind advice at all, keep it coming. I do mind when it's repeated over and over because my reply might differ or be contradictory.
I'll try your suggestion sometime soon.
Tonight it was just plain to hot so I feed her 7g @ 125g with hopes that her weight will be near 117g in the cool of the morning. I'll let you know what happens.

[wesleyc6]

hehehehe, I know what ya mean. I think most of mine burned .5-.7g/hr off a full feed when around hunting weight. Much slower when they were heavier and closer to 1g/hr when they were REALLY tight. THat is one thing I look for as I am lowering their weight. It was always sort of my safety net as lowering the little guys always made me nervous too.

It has been the coolest summer in Texas in a while. [smilie=banana.gif]

[hawkstir]

She at 122g. @ 10:00 am. She was 132g @ 5:00 pm. She's lost 10g in a 17 hr. overnight. That's less then a gram per hour. It's already hot out and will only be getting hotter. 5 more hours will put us at mid afternoon, way to hot then. [smilie=eusa_think.gif] I want to fly her, but I think if I do it now, I'll have the same experience as I've been having and I don't want to reinforce it. I think I'll wait for evening to fly, she may be low, but I'm home and can check on her often and make a change in plan if I have to. It should be cooler then and I'll see how she acts when empty. There should be more bird activity then also, IE; better chance of a slip.

[kimmerar]

Hey Fred - what are you feeding her. I noticed with my last bird that weight loss would change with quail and mice. We went out a lot and she lost less weight with quail. I would sometimes miss the weight - too high - when feeding quail. So while hunting - I fed mice. When I didn't fly her the weight would slow down alot too. If she hits weight at say 2 then let her chase the lure for a wing and you can still go out later. You can really get some meat off if needed to with a starling wing. If you need more to get her through then pull the wing instead of breaking it. Sorry so blunt and sorry if you already know that. I did better last year with twice a day feeding. If I knew rain was coming or couldn't go out then I would let her feed up and let her cache it and do kestrel things. Just something else to think about.

[[HOA]hawk]

At what temp do you not fly her? 90s-100s or upper 80s?

[hawkstir]

Kim,
I like to mix the food up a bit. The last couple of days has been starling and mice. I have out in my mew now, it's an 8x8 room where she can move from perch to perch rather than being tethered. I'm using this time to do some rework on her block perch. I'm thinking I'll go get some grasshoppers and put them in the mew for her to chase and catch.
It's close to 90 and very sunny right now. She probably doesn't mind the heat as much as I do. Poor excuse, I know.

[hawkstir]

Murphy at work. I go in the mew to weight KC and she'd been in the bath pan and was soaking wet. 127g.
I was going to feed her anyways. I weighed out 20g with half on the lure and the other half in my bag. I walk out to the high grass and she starts chasing grasshoppers off the fist while their still in the air. After catching and eating a couple of those she flies up to a perch. I walk off a short distance and swing the lure. She comes instantly and puts in a good pass on it and then lands on the ground on the back swing. She flies to another perch and I start to swing it again. This time she catches it in the air and rides it down to the ground as I let it drop. She does mantle and tries to drag it off, but after she settles and starts to eat she pulls it between my feet to finish eating.
Much better performance tonight. I wish I knew her weight. After eating she weighed 140g.

[hawkstir]

Last evening she was at 117g.. I've switched over from a 2 a day feed schedule, to the 22 hr. system.
She was so so after grasshoppers, caught a couple off the fist, then flew off to a perch. Called her back, she came, checked the glove, didn't land and flew back to same perch. Called again, this time she came and landed, took and eat a tidbit. I tossed her off back to the perch, about 25 yds. off, 15 ft. high. I called her back but this time, just after she left the perch, I pitched a baggy in the air from behind my back, it struggled to gain speed as she quickly closed in on it and racked it hard. She flew on and turned hard, coming back and bound to it as it banked left, riding it to the ground where she lost footing for a moment, but bounced up and ran it down within a foot or two.
I was so mezmerized by the flight that I almost forgot to make in. She mantled for a bit as I reached in to make sure all was under control and finish the bag. Then I let her take her time and feed for a while. Mostly plucked feathers. She traded off to a leg well and we went home were I finished feeding her to 140g.

[hawkstir]

Not much new happening. At 117g, she flies good at grasshoppers but not interested in birds. Starting to chase butterflies. The other day I tried to get her to go after dragonflies. She flew off to a perch and started getting harrassed by a wild female k-bird. It put her off a bit and wouldn't come to the glove. I had to call her down with the lure and call it a day.
Last night I slipped a baggy out of my bag while she was on my glove. She gave chase but broke off after about 20 yard chase. Couldn't find the bag for a reflush. She was a bit high at 119g. but needs to fly. I did get a couple good lure flights out of her.

[wesleyc6]

Fred, I am enjoying your log. Thanks

Get used to kestrels in the field. LOL. Actually pray it will be a kestrel and not a bigger air shark. I watched mine sky up one morning with another kestrel and thought I was going to die. They went all the way up in just about a minute too!

Have you thought of trying to get your little gal to wait on since it is so hot and if you are like GA was, you are still a couple of months out from good sparrow populations in the fields.

[hawkstir]

Wes,
Yea. I wasn't sure what to expect. Whether the wild one would attack or if they would fly off together or who knows what. It was a nice looking female. They put on a short show before KC perched up and the visitor flew off. I'm always worried about those air sharks. Had what looked like a Gos working about 2 hundreds yards off last night. KC was on a wire over my head. I was trying to move something under her when I noticed it. I kept myself as visable to it as I could, thinking it wouldn't want to come around me. It moved on.
She has hovered over me but then will perch up or land on my head or glove. We're both green at this and try to learn something new each time out.
The good news is it rained last night and it's only 70 today, overcast with a light breeze. I fed her a couple grams light last night and with any luck she'll be spot on and ready to rock and roll this afternoon.
Good hawk'n

[hawkstir]

115g and she's wiping out the grasshoppers. After 1/2 hour walking around the yard she was up to 119g which means she caught 4g of the little bugs. It's not stylish like a redtail's wing-over or falcon's stoop, but it's fun. I'm going to fly her again this evening.

[hawkstir]

So after supper I took the dogs out to do their thing and I hear the jingle of a bell but it's not coming from the mews. I hear it again and am able to zero in on it. It's out in the front yard and headed in my direction. By now I know KC had gotten out and was flying loose. I grabbed some tidbits and the lure which I had ready to go already. By time I stepped back out KC was on the roof of the mew scoulding me. I called to the dogs and put them inside. I call KC to the glove and check her weight. 120g which tells me she must of been catching some more hoppers on her own. We did so flights to the glove and lure and then I put her up for the night inside. Sunday morning I found the hole she got out through and fixed it.

[kimmerar]

Wow - good thing she was still around. It's so hot here 106 yesterday - heat index 115 to 120. If a bird got out here it would not go too far. You've got her trained well it sounds like. How did she get out - or is that a subject you don't want to talk about.?

[hawkstir]

I'll try to. I have a pair of doors that open from the mew into the weathering area. I closed them for the little k-bird because I knew she could get out through the wire and lattice. I don't notice that there were baseball sized holes at the bottom and each side of the door, the jamb is a few inches short of hitting the ground. I have carpet inside that was rolled against the door and ether she pulled it or the wind blow it enough to expose the holes and she crawled out. I've got it closed now. [smilie=eusa_pray.gif] I'm glad she didn't get attacked or catch anything and crop up before I relized what was up.

[hawkstir]

I brought KC to work with me today because I'd been seeing about 1/2 doz. starlings outside my window every morning for the last week. Well wouldn't know it. Murphy came around and no starlings anywhere.

The guys in the shop had been asking about her so I took her over while they where on their lunch break. I let her fly to a perch and call her back as a sort of demo. While she was standing on my glove, one of the workers flushes a young swallow out of a stack of timbers. KC flashes off my fist and nails it right in all our faces. With six chins on the ground, and 12 pie sized eyes watching, she tried to drag it under the timbers. I quickly pinned and hooked a jesse. Then picked the whole thing up. After she settled, I popped the head and disposed of the rest.

I'm going to go back over to the shop after work and see what we can find. Word is there's a bunch of birds in the storage barn and mice running every where.

[Rudd]

That must have been quite the sight. Is this her first bird?

[hawkstir]

That must have been quite the sight. Is this her first bird?
Yes, other than a couple of baggies.

[everetkhorton]

[quote="hawkstir"]I brought KC to work with me today because I'd been seeing about 1/2 doz. starlings outside my window every morning for the last week. Well wouldn't know it. Murphy came around and no starlings anywhere.

The guys in the shop had been asking about her so I took her over while they where on their lunch break. I let her fly to a perch and call her back as a sort of demo. While she was standing on my glove, one of the workers flushes a young swallow out of a stack of timbers. KC flashes off my fist and nails it right in all our faces. With six chins on the ground, and 12 pie sized eyes watching, she tried to drag it under the timbers. I quickly pinned and hooked a jesse. Then picked the whole thing up. After she settled, I popped the head and disposed of the rest.

I'm going to go back over to the shop after work and see what we can find. Word is there's a

Fred:
Outstanding to say the least [smilie=icon_thumright.gif] Have you ever thought of setting up a feeding station or bird feeder. Anything to draw the bird there. Some times you just need a ace in the hole.

[hawkstir]

Ev, I've had traps set here for the longest time, but I've never caught anything in them. I've watched the birds move all around them, but they won't go in.

[gabboon]

Ev, I've had traps set here for the longest time, but I've never caught anything in them. I've watched the birds move all around them, but they won't go in.

try a pan of water. Sometimes food doesn't work, but a shallow pool of water in the open where the flock can watch for predators is very tempting.

[Jimmy]

WooHoo Fred. Congrats on the kill!!

[everetkhorton]

Ev, I've had traps set here for the longest time, but I've never caught anything in them. I've watched the birds move all around them, but they won't go in.

Fred:
I was thinking of just a place to hunt that you know there will be birds. It is hard to trap bird when there is food every where.

[kimmerar]

WTG Fred!!!! And you had an audiance!!! She'll get better and better now!!!

[hawkstir]

Ev, I've had traps set here for the longest time, but I've never caught anything in them. I've watched the birds move all around them, but they won't go in.

Fred:
I was thinking of just a place to hunt that you know there will be birds. It is hard to trap bird when there is food every where.

This is probably the best place to hunt. I know there's game here. I can run and get KC out almost anytime there's a potential slip, and check on her often also. The bosses don't mind as long as I put in my 8/day or 40/week. I pretty much make my own schedule. I usually get done at 3 pm and there are barns to check on the way home if things don't work out here. With the weather starting to turn cooler, I think she'll be making more trips with me.

[hawkstir]

Nothing after work but I found a farm that is just loaded with sparrows and starlings. I mean hundreds. I couldn't find anyone around, however I didn't have the right footwear to go into all the places to look. I'll stop by in the morning when I've seen people working there. I'm taking a trap to set along with getting permission to hunt.

[everetkhorton]

[quote="hawkstir"]Nothing after work but I found a farm that is just loaded with sparrows and starlings. I mean hundreds. I couldn't find anyone around, however I didn't have the right footwear to go into all the places to look. I'll stop by in the morning when I've seen people working there. I'm
Fred:
I hope it works out for ya!

[wesleyc6]

Good show!!!!

[hawkstir]

It's been a few days sence I've had KC out flying due to rain. I've been manning and hooding mostly. Last night I was cleaning up around her perch and she attacked the car wash sponge I was using and wouldn't let go. This sponge is the size of a small rabbit and was in my right hand while I was scrubbing mutes. I have no clue what she was thinking. Kind of funny actually.

[hawkstir]

Took KC to work with me today. I saw a hand full of starlings hanging around the front of the old farm house I work out of, so I went outside and got her and put her up. She flew up and perched on the main roof while the starlings stayed on the porch roof below her. She looked but didn't make any attempts at them. Eventually they left, so I called her down and put her away so I could get back to work. She weighed 110g at that time.
I got her back out after lunch break and let her fly around a little, showed her off to some coworkers, gave her a good squirting down and a couple tidbits.
After work I went and checked out a barn that she had given chase in and couldn't find any birds. They were all out in the corn fields. Then I went over to the main farm complex and just as I was about to slip her on some sparrows I noticed a redtail circling low above us. It was slicing through the sparrows as they were flushing and circling also. Not worth the risk, so I put her back in the truck and went and spoke with the farmer. He told me they plan to start chopping the corn next week which should remove their daytime cover or at least move them into narrower strips.
Closer to home I stopped at a small ranch with a horse barn and they let me fly her inside. We chased a couple out the far end but that was all the action we could get in there. I found a small group down by a small wash and was working toward a flush when she took off chasing a large hopper. It was about a 15 yd. flight with a few twists and turns before she snagged it out of the air and perched up on a fence post to eat it. The sparrows were holding tight in some bushes so I called her over and while she was in the air I threw a rock into the bush to flush the birds. Well she crashed the bush and killed the rock in grand fashion while the sparrows flew away. After a couple more hoppers and missed slips at birds I called it a day. The last session she weighed in at 105g.
I put her up at home at 112g and we'll see if she show better interest in the starlings at work in the morning. She is starting to show a little more style to her flights and not just the 5 ft grasshopper crashes off the glove.

[kimmerar]

Get a BB gun - get her to know the color black. Fishing line works great for setting up a slip. When she hits it then break it open for her and let her eat up. Took doing that 2 times last year and mine got it - she quit that playing around thing. JMO

[hawkstir]

Had the crap scared out of me this afternoon. Had KC on the eave of a barn working some sparrows down the edge. I was walking to the far end in hopes of pinching them and give her a chance to at least chase one. She seemed interested. I heard her bell jingle and looked back just in time to see a cooper barely miss her before flying back to a large tree to perch. I called to her the glove and we moved on to a new location.
She still hasn't killed any birds but her grasshopper flights are getting more aeronautical.

[everetkhorton]

Fred:
I took a trip to my daughters for a over nighter. She lives about 140 mi.
South of me and on the way down I noticed a flock of Starling taking a
bath in a puddle in the middle of the road. I was thinking of the guy's in
the far South that can not find Starling and Sparrow why not put down a piece of plastic and keep water it it, some problem would have to be worked out. Keep water in it and watch for bird to use it. It could be on the way to a field etc. Just something to think about. Fred, has you ever
use Starlilng for live luring?

[kimmerar]

You're right Ev. Last year our first double was after a rain and throughout the season we always found them around water. She would go up if the puddle was too big though. Her first kill both ended up in a small puddle and she looked like a muddy wet mess. The starlings love water puddles. Morning and evening.

[chamokane]

There's a falconer here who flew a Kestrel when he was a kid. Whenever it rained, he would perch the K on the handle bar of his bike and take off down the road. When he found wet Starlings, the K caught one pretty easily. Starlings can barely fly if they are good and wet; I used to catch them by hand when it was raining when I was a kid. Hunting in the rain might be a good way to enter a young bird.

[hawkstir]

Interesting thoughts. I'll keep on my list of things to try. Thanks

[Lee]

3 or 4 starling baggies would go a long way with her right now

[hawkstir]

No kidding. Trying like heck to get something trapped. I've even got another falconer trying and a couple of coworkers but we're all coming up empty. Very frustrating. Anybody got some concussion gernades? [smilie=eusa_doh.gif]

[kimmerar]

I ran into the same problem last year. That's why I went with a BB gun and fishing line.

[hawkstir]

I'm going to offer KC up for transfer to 2nd year apprentice or higher within PA only. I foresee myself getting a RT this fall and having very limited time available for her. If no takers I will continue to do my best by her.

[everetkhorton]

I'm going to offer KC up for transfer to 2nd year apprentice or higher within PA only. I foresee myself getting a RT this fall and having very limited time available for her. If no takers I will continue to do my best by her.

Fred:
Do you think the hopper hunting slower her down for hunting birds?

[Falcon Boy]

almost everyone i've read about hunts grasshoppers with their kestrels first

[everetkhorton]

almost everyone i've read about hunts grasshoppers with their kestrels first
Kim:
Did you hunt hopper first? Anyone know why you would do this. Maybe good food for a young bird [smilie=dontknow.gif]

[Falcon Boy]

hers was a passage, sorry i was referring to people who raise imprint kessies.

[kimmerar]

I would think hoppers would help them get fit enough to catch birds. But his bird has been doing that and should be ready for some starlings. I had no luck - so again - I used a BB gun and fishing line - then when she started catching black I moved to brown catournix.

From what I've seen I want a passage - I will not imprint a kestrel. SHARPIE!!!!!!

[hawkstir]

EV,
I don't think the hoppers has anything to do with it. If anything it helps to teach her to hunt and not depend on me for food.

I think the real problem is the lack of baggies and reasonable slips at birds.

Tonight she acted very low, she was at 101g and didn't even want hoppers, so I'm going to bring her weight back up for a while. In the mean time I'll break out the BB gun, 20 gauge if required, and get some baggies. Then I'll start all over except for the glove and lure, she's got that down real well.

I just want to make it clear that I'm not giving up on her. I just think that if I can find someone that will have the time and be able to produce better hunting for her, she should have the opportunity. I'm trying to do what I think is best for her.

[kimmerar]

I love Lee's idea of feeding off of a starling body. I will do that if I ever get the chance to raise an eyeas kestrel or any bird slayer. Fred - my husband helped with the fishing line - do you have some one to help set it up for you. I really like the t-perch too but you have to slip around corners for it to work. I will reread M Mullinex's book about entering in the field. Have you read it. Kestrel fans has a lot of info on these birds too. You could post your question there and you WILL get a reply from someone. Bugs are fixing to start disappearing so she must move to birds sometime soon.. Good luck and keep us informed. You'll get it.

[hawkstir]

Kim,
Yes to all your questions. I read Kestrel fans but don't post there much.

[hawkstir]

This morning while cleaning up KC's mew and perches I saw a dove in my driveway. Dove season just opened today so what the heck. I got KC and walked up to about 10 ft of the dove which just sat there on the ground. When it did fly, KC gave a half hearted chase and came real close. I know it's a lot to ask of a Kestrel but like I sead, what the heck.
Kim,
Can you explain your typical baggie on a string method for me. I have a frozen sparrow thawing and would like to try something with it later today.

[kimmerar]

Have someone hide behind a bush. Have the sparrow tied to a fishing line - I would make it like 20lb because she will want to carry the sparrow (natural instict to get off the ground for a kbird - death happens on the ground for them). You do not want the line to break during this. Wrap the line and tie diffentent knots a few times just in case. I wrapped around the body and aroung the joint where the wing attatches to the body - the head is what she liked most. You have her on your fist and walk towards the moving bird. The person is dragging and mildly jerking the bird to make it look alive. If you see the slip is not going to work then turn around and go back and try again until she sees it. You'll know by her being slick - and looking. Head bobbing didn't work as a sign of attack for my bird last year. They head bob at anything. Its that slick body lowered look you're looking for. When I started flushing planted loose quail is when I turned her loose in the trees to wait for a flush. If you want that affect with a stringed bird then I would hang the bag over the bush in mid air ( i wanted to do this to get her to take birds in the air) and pull gently from the other side and see what response you get. If she is the type that doesn't want to hit in the air then have it real close to the ground. The 20 pound line should work and not get too tangled up - but again I didn't try it - this is a thought. If the fishing line hangs up then try some kite string.

My sponser strongly suggested to me last year with my passage to not have her hit sparrows due to carrying. I didn't listen and had a perfect slip on a sparrow - tried it - from the fist - and sure enough she flew everywhere with it trying to find a place to hide and eat it. After that - sparrows were not hunted. He stresses that if they are manned well enough and they carry - then let them eat and wait patiently and they will come back to the lure after finishing if she is wed to it - last year I always carried a starling or large catournix (cant carry) in my bag and yes, a few times, I had to use it to get her to come back .

Oh - I had a problem with grass being to high - we drove dirt roads that had dirt off the side of it with short grass. I'm sure you get that. It's dead so it will not fly up so dragging is what I did while my husband was behind the bush.

Sorry this turned out so long - hope I explained that right. Again - I would highly recommend getting a starling and get her onto black - and get out of her maybe carrying - they can drag one but not fly off with it.

[hawkstir]

Thanks Kim. That's what I was thinking. Just wanted to hear it from somebody else.

[Lee]

Doves have loose plummage so its hard for hawks to hold them they mostly end up with feet full of feathers and the dove hauling butt away.

[hawkstir]

Doves have loose plummage so its hard for hawks to hold them they mostly end up with feet full of feathers and the dove hauling butt away.

I know. It was worth a shot though.

I got my wife to help me with a baggie on a string like Kim had described. She hid behind a tall hedge and drug the sparrow across my driveway. I know sooner turned the corner of the house, about 70 ft. away and KC batted. After she regained herself I let loose of the jesses and she flew straight to the sparrow and clamped on. On my approach she tried to drag it off but I had attached a short line with some weight on it so she couldn't get far. I let her eat all she wanted after she finally settled down. I don't think she has any problem taking game on the ground. Now I need to work on getting her to take it in the air.

[kimmerar]

That's what I wanted to work on but never got to continue - due to a foot injury. I was throwing starlings in the air. She would look at me and wait for them to hit the ground and try to hit it. I would pick it up real fast and rethrow trying to make it so she had to get them in the air. She finally did it and the next day hit that fence. I know I could have got her to do it - but she's gone now and I will hopefully have new bird soon. My last one would not hit a collared dove but she would chase a mourning dove. Lee - I heard the same thing about them just ending up with feathers - maybe after a good season and after the molt.

I would definately try the hanging a baggie over a bush - once you know she has the program. Then maybe you can get her to hit in the air. From what I understand - alot don't but some do and if your bird is arial with bugs then she should come around.

Catournix are awesome for a confidence boost for them and you working with her - start with 3 week old and soon she'll be taking the 160 grammers. Have your wife go out in the field and tuck the head under the wing and set it down = they sit there frozen - the guys I get quail from has quail hunting packages and that's how he plants bobwhites - walk along and flush it and see what happens. I had a problem with entering too so until I figured it out that's how we ended every outing. She had to catch her food.

Sounds like she's coming around and that baiting on the fist will slow down when she realizes your working together. Mine was real bad at first too - but she got over it and all that happened was that slick look when she got something in her sights and she waited for me to mildly toss her - and yes even in the field.

How is it going with her feather condition - I failed miserably at that - there was a sponser here on the forum that would not have let me count my first year - it was bad. She would mantle over her food and sit on her tail feathers - I would keep moving them but she would sit right on top of them - she ended up breaking a few off her train.

[hawkstir]

I checked KC's weight this morning and she was at 105g but I wasn't ready to hunt so I gave her a sparrow head to work on.
This afternoon Rusty caught and killed a dove, and after a short disagreement over ownership I managed to get it from him. I tied it to a piece of line that I ran over a tree branch. I tucked the dove behind the base of the tree and walked the other end out about 20 ft. where I left it tied to a stick on the ground. I got KC out (106g) and we kicked about the high grass where she caught 1/2 doz. hoppers. A couple of which she took from a perch while I walked about under her. Up to now they've all been off the fist. They I approached the stick with KC on the fist. When I pulled the line the dove popped out from behind the tree and swung up into the air. She flew to the dove that was now dangling while I jerked it about best I could She missed it on the first pass but turned and hit it in the air. I let her dangle from it just for a second or two with a couple more short jerks and then let it fall to the ground. She dragged it to the base of the tree and mantled over it. I let her break in while I collected up the string. After sitting next to her for a while I transfered her to the head without any problem. I leashed her to her bow perch outside and let her eat in piece while I put things away.

[kimmerar]

Yeah Fred!! [smilie=banana.gif] She should be there any time. I'm glad she hit it. She's not afraid so she just needs practice. Ya know - I bet there are young dove out and about right now that are sloppy at flying - if you can hunt them yet - apparently so? She'll get it soon - if she hasn't already.

The lady over our falconry dept for our state used to fly kestrels. She had one that she had trained up on white leghorn chicks. The chicks grew and one time she hit a 4 to 5 week old BIG chicken that was now running around in her yard free!! Hit the head and would not let go.

I couldn't wait to see what you had done today. Keep it up.

[hawkstir]

Thanks for all your help, Kim.
Sense my experience has been with RT's, I guess I'm a little impatient. It's taking much longer then I had thought. I'm going back to a two a day feeding. She seems to have more energy that way. I'm also bringing her weight back up a little. I think I had her to low and she wouldn't expend the energy to make a flight.
If at first you don't succeed, try try again.

[Jimmy]

Sounds like things are improving some........
Any chance you're reconsidering the transfer offer?

[kimmerar]

I think your on the right course. Yes - twice a day is good until she gets the swing of things (I always weighed twice a day unless I let her feed up after a good flight) and I thought the same thing about her being too low. I think your might be there with the 106 or whatever weight she was at when she hit the dove. Even though she missed the first time - I bet thats inexperience. My sponser says with falcons - take your time and it will all come out good in the end. It's not a race. If she's wed to the lure (which she is) then you can always get her fit.

Get you a RT - something you're familiar with and play with KC too. If you don't have time to hunt both on the same day then work her on the lure for awhile. End every outing with a bird kill (whether it's set up or not) and remember - the bugs will be gone soon.

If you do transfer her - you have set it up good for the person getting her - I think you should reconsider. If you do get rid of her - I still recommend you trapping one and trying it sometime - it's different then and imprint - JMO. I played with one for 3 weeks and she was scared of everything - made me realize I will trap one - not raise it.

[hawkstir]

Kim.
I might not be able to always end on a bird kill but I do always end on the lure. I think your right that she is well set up for another falconer to take over. I would prefer somebody with more experience then a first year apprentice. Another option for her when I get my RT is to try and force moult her through the winter so she'd be ready to go come spring. Just one of my original thoughts. I think 105, give or take a gram, I might even try higher yet, I've always tended to fly my birds a touch on the fat side. As long as she comes to the lure I fell secure doing that and right now she needs to build some muscle and endurance, something I think she lost with me trying to go to fast with her.

By the way:
Happy holiday every body.
Be safe and good hawk'n.

[kimmerar]

I like the idea of the forced molt if that's an option for you. That's why Lee needs to keep us informed on what he's doing. A lure or a bag is what I ment.

In Arkansas - apprentices are not allowed a transfered bird. I'm sure we're not the only one. The lady over the falconry dept says that's too easy. You MUST trap and train a bird.

I had to come to work today and now my boss is telling me to go home - he just wanted to see who would show up!! I found a female kestrel yesterday real close to the house - I'm going over to visit with a trap in hand. We'll see what happens. She was pretty spooky yesterday and I did not see a male around. I would have prefered to go at sunrise but - ya never know.

Happy Labor Day!!!

[hawkstir]

"Oh my freaking gosh". KC made her first official kill today. "Oh my freaking gosh." [smilie=banana.gif] [smilie=banana.gif] [smilie=banana.gif]

She was at 109g which was a little heavier then I had hoped but the skies were clouding up and I figured if we were going it'd better be now. So I was walking her up through the field behind the house towards an old half fallen down barn. There has always been birds around it. They have it boarded up for safety so I wouldn't be able to slip her inside but I was hoping for something around it outside. AS we approached I noticed a flock of sparrows with a few larks mixed in. Also lots of doves. All the birds flew up onto the wires when we got close so I let her fly up to the top of the barn while I kicked around the grass and brush under her. Nothing happening there. I called her down to the fist and moved toward a small stock pond. She took off after something on the other side but soon came back with nothing but muddy feet. She went back up on the barn while I finished the circle around the bottom. As I turned the corner I saw that the birds had left the wire and were in the 6-8" tall grass. I called KC down to the glove and tried to sneak toward the flock. I saw another k-bird perched on some hay bales and waited a bit until it decided to fly off. I continued toward the birds which were bumping ahead when ever we got to within about 50 yards. I was thinking of casting her into the wind but there really wasn't any to speak of and what there was, was the wrong direction. I just kept moving forward slowly when I saw a bird flush and start to fly on an angle back toward us. KC bolted off the glove and was closing on it when it dumped into the grass about 50 yds. out. She did what looked like a redtail wingover and dove into the grass at the same spot. I was running as fast as I could and could hear the screams of a bird. "Oh my freaking gosh" she caught it, I kept saying to my self. When I got there she had it throttled by the head. I slipped in and quickly finished it off. Once I hooked her up secure I sat back beside her and let her do what ever she wanted with it. After about 15 min. she had barely broken in so I reach in and pulled a leg off which I saved. Then I popped the head and let her settle on that for a few more minutes. Then I picked her up with the leg in my glove and let her work on that all the way home. Once at home I let her have a lions share of fresh kill.

By the way did I mention; "Oh my freaking gosh" she made a kill.

"Oh my freaking gosh" is a nice way of saying what I was really saying.

[wesleyc6]

Man, that is awesome Fred!!!! They really can do it. You just have to see it to REALLY believe it. This is something I learned after my first one. They SHOULD have all the aggession towards game that a RT has. The only difference is that even at weight, they won't waste time on a bad slip since birds just leave. A RT however on squirrels can take a bad slip, because they almost always catch up to a squirrel.

I am so proud for you!

[Jimmy]

HOT DAMN!!!!!!
Way to go!!!!!

[kimmerar]

HOT DAMN!!!!!!
Way to go!!!!!

I agree!! Isn't it awesome. You've got a great bird. It just takes figuring it out. OK - now I'm gonna ask - Still gonna transfer her?

Loved the story - I smiled while I read it. Now start a hunting log. Is that available here??? Keep up the good work.

[sharptail]

Thats Great Fred, with a little luck you will be able to keep her goin [smilie=eusa_clap.gif]

[hawkstir]

Thanks everyone for your help. I think and hopefully am correct, that she's got it figured out. And yes Kim, I would transfer her to the right person.

[hawkstir]

Tonight she was at 110g. We went back to the same field and she put on quite a show chasing and manuvering but never connected. That extra gram may of done it or the other kbirds flying about. They were putting on a show also, after the same birds. I actually got confused as to which one was KC at one point. She also seemed to get a little confused when she would start off chasing one and break on another. They were popping out all over one at a time, not in a big flock at once. She did get lots of exercise which she probably needs plenty of, considering I had down to low for a while.

[kimmerar]

I do believe 1 gram matters early on. Are you worried she may decide to migrate with the rest? If that's what is going on. How did you end the day?

[hawkstir]

I hadn't even considered that she might want to migrate. [smilie=eusa_doh.gif]
I finished by calling her to the lure. Here's a few pics.
I was probably jinx because I had my camera with us.
http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c397/hawkstir/100_0139.jpg
http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c397/hawkstir/100_0138.jpg
http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c397/hawkstir/100_0137.jpg

[hawkstir]

Tonight I screwed up. When I weighed her she tipped in at 105g so thinking it'd be a couple hours before flying I gave her a few grams to bring her up to 109g. I was hoping it would energize and hydrate her a little. My mistake was that I didn't notice that her 4g neck bell was off. 105g would of been just right. So I took her out despite the fact that now she had something in her crop. She responded fine and chased but wouldn't engage. She was more interested in catching hoppers which we cleaned up on on the way back to the house. I left her out in the yard while I got a live dove tethered to a drag weight. Then I walked out into the yard, located where she was perched, called her to the glove and while she was coming towards me I pitched the dove out. She stooped it, turned and throttled it just as it hit the ground. I let her eat the head off then transfered her to lure for the last of her meal.

[kimmerar]

[smilie=eusa_clap.gif] That's great Fred. You two are getting it. Even at the weight she was at she hit a live DOVE [smilie=icon_pray.gif] !!! Awesome - you've done well. I'm jealous and I NEED A BIRD!!!

[hawkstir]

Yes, I think she knows what she's supposed to do. She's playing hard ball with me, trying to train me. I may need to give her a dose of touch love and put her up hungry, but not too. I'll wait for the weekend for that so I can get her out first thing in the AM.

[kimmerar]

I may need to give her a dose of touch love and put her up hungry, but not too.

Yes - tough love is right - let her eat up when she hits a dove or any live birds. Just a leg or wing off the lure if not. Sometimes it takes a small tidbit to get motivation going to. Or on my last bird it did.

[hawkstir]

It was a piss poor hunting week. Between my schedule and very hot, humid weather we didn't get out for much serious hunting. One night she chased a few but wouldn't close the deal. The next afternoon she was a little low. I got to within 20 ft. of a flock of 100's of sparrows and she just sat on the glove looking at me as if to say WTF as they flew away. Two other days we couldn't find birds but wiped out quite a few hoppers. I think her best weight is 105g. Really puts on a show at that mark. They're calling for a couple days of rain and some cooler weather. I hope that helps.

[hawkstir]

A double. Sort of.
We couldn't find any birds and very few hoppers. Much cooler and the grass is still a little wet from recent rains. There had been several large stacks of hay bales up in the field, which the farmer must of just moved off leaving one bale behind at each spot. These are the small pickup sized square bales. Any how. I put KC on one of the bales and kicked around the bottom. Two moles ran out and she flew down and caught one. Then she saw the other, letting go of the first she ran down the second and held on. The first one was dazed or injured and couldn't move too well so I snatched it up with a final squeeze and dropped it in my pouch. KC was working on the first so I let her eat about half and then scooped her and her prize up and headed for home. She finished it off on the way.

[hawkstir]

After almost 2 months of no activity I had time to get KC out for a sort of hunt. I have to confess, I haven't put out much effort on her behalf lately. I thought I had her transfered but that seems to have fallen through. So after reading all the hunting stories and waiting for my RT to drop weight, I was itching to do something so at 112g she flew hard and caught several grasshoppers. We couldn't find any birds to chase. She showed no interest in the glove but pounded the lure in the air when it was time to end the fun.

[Jimmy]

I've been wondering if you still had her, Fred.

[kimmerar]

Thanks for the update Fred. Did you get frustrated? I am - no birds. Here for a day and then leave. Cold front again tomorrow so Tues will be good.

[hawkstir]

Thanks for the update Fred. Did you get frustrated? I am - no birds. Here for a day and then leave. Cold front again tomorrow so Tues will be good.

Frustrated? Yes. With the lack of good slips. Not with the bird. I think she would be a great bird in the right hands. I've learned a Kestrel is not the right bird for me, for the game available or for my style of hawking. My options now are to take care of her and give as much air time as I can and hope I can find someone to transfer her to.

[kimmerar]

I'm running into rain now - high today 48 but it's been raining since sun evening and will rain for 2 more days. Lack of slips should not be a problem after the rain quits here- CAN'T WAIT. It's been a week since I've gotten anything. Not due to lack of trying.

You'll find the right person for her. You've done great with her and she's a good sized bird too.

[hawkstir]

Yesterday I had let KC free fly about the yard as I have been doing for a while now. After getting some tidbits around and loading the lure I went to find her assuming she'd be on the roof or one of a few favorite perches she has. She was no where to be seen nor could I hear her usual calling. I blew the whistle and swung the lure but again she was a no show. I spent an hour looking around all the trees and bushes to see if I could find her, but again she's a no show. I fully expected her to show back up during the afternoon but she never did. This morning I left some food on by her bow perch. I'll check to see if it's been touched when i get home.

[kimmerar]

So sorry Fred - maybe she'll be back. You did well with her and she can take birds - so - maybe that migration bug got her. My sponser says the lure is the way to go. He's had them gone for a day or two - being chased - and the lure will get them if the bird is around. During the summer he leaves them out during the day to catch bugs and brings them in at night.

[hawkstir]

Thanks Kim,
My biggest concern is the other BOPs and cats. My hope is that she made a kill and was hiding and eating well. I'm also concerned because last night we had our first killing frost. I'm trying to keep positive thoughts.

[wesleyc6]

Fred,
I hope you find her buddy. I would look around under bushes if you have a limited amount for signs of a kill.

[hawkstir]

Still a no show. The food I left out was untouched. I traveled a couple miles in the downwind direction yesterday, stopping often to whistle and swing the lure. I've all around the bushes and any cover I thought might give me a clue but no luck. I'm keeping my fingers crossed.

[hawkstir]

Yesterday afternoon, my wife thought she saw KC fly by. I went looking but couldn't spot her nor got any responce to the lure and whistle. There were alot of doves in the area and she does like to chase them and has killed dove baggies. My hopes are that the sighting was accurate and that she is doing OK on her own.