Hi from South Jersey [Archive] - North American Falconers Exchange-Falconry Forums

ptotten

10-21-2010, 09:22 AM

Hi! I'm a dirt hawker from South Jersey (Cape May Co. to be exact). My husband Paul & I have been falconers since 1992. Members of NAFA and New Jersey Falconry Club. I originally perused this site in search for info. about hunting with our new doxie Shorty, who is part of Teddy Moritz's line. We have a new RT to train over him (he's 4 months old now) but I would really like to try him with my 12X Intermewed Hen RT.

everetkhorton

10-21-2010, 11:49 PM

(welc)Peg, I am sure some one will jump in and give you a hand with the new dog. You may want to drop drop down to the dog sec. also.
Have fun with the new pup!

zero

10-22-2010, 12:25 AM

(welc)!!!!!

I miss NJ, used to live in Ventnor.

Joby

10-22-2010, 08:10 AM

Actually, if Peg is Paul Aliya's wife, then I KNOW there is not much we can probably tell her about working with doxies and birds that she, her husband, and her brother in law don't already know. From what I understand they are all pretty darn good falconers. ;) Welcome to the board Peg and good luck with the new endeavor!
-Joby

ptotten

10-22-2010, 08:28 AM

Thanks, Joe but I am not Paul Elia's wife, I am actually Paul Totten's wife. I gleaned alot of info. about the Dox from Paul while we were trapping a few weeks ago, and I still have to get in touch with Teddy, the ultimate question answerer, I'm sure!

joekoz

10-22-2010, 08:38 AM

Joe, actual Peggy isn't Paul Eliya's wife.

Peggy, good to see you on this site. Is the new puppy from Stu Brown's recent litter? One of the 4 he had in the pen in his yard at this past summers club picnic held at his home?

ptotten

10-22-2010, 08:48 AM

Thanks for the welcome Everet...yes, I have been to the dog forum, many times and have received some good info. on starting the dog under an already trained hawk. My husband's hawk came down on a doxie pretty hard a few years ago....got 'em right in the roof of the mouth with the hallux....Ooo! My hawk pays too much attention to our Brittany, but has only given her a few warning shots. I'm not sure what will happen when we start the doxie under her. For right now while we are dropping weight coming off the moult, I am trying to man them together as much as possible. She has never been very keen on dogs in the feild.
Hi to Sufyan....wow Ventnor to Oregon is a BIG jump! What took you to Oregon?

ptotten

10-22-2010, 08:59 AM

Yes he is Joe! We took the runt. Cute little guy, but we know NOTHING about them except that they are excellent rabbit dogs. The temperment has been a bit of a surprise, since our Brittany was/still is ALL TO WILLING to please! The doxie seems a little more independent thus requiring more training in that area so he knows who's the boss!

ptotten

10-22-2010, 11:06 AM

One quick after thought......my opinions do not neccessarily reflect those of my husband's.......a marriage disclaimer! boxingg

mainefalconer

10-22-2010, 04:55 PM

Peg,

Good to see you here. When I was staying with Phil and Paul last year, I really enjoyed watching their dogs work with the hawks. It really made me wish that I lived in an area with rabbits. I'd love to have a pair of those little beasts! But I suppose it's pointing breeds for me! I hope to see you in the field this winter.

ptotten

10-25-2010, 03:48 PM

Thanks, Scott. Yeah, they're little rabbit hunting machines. I'm a little concerned about my FRT, though. 12X intermewed and not so hot on dogs to begin with. She's given our Brittany a few warning shots before, but she's 7 or 8 times the weight of our little guy! Still trying to get them together in the same proximity for now, but in a few short weeks...we shall see....

everetkhorton

10-25-2010, 04:35 PM

One quick after thought......my opinions do not neccessarily reflect those of my husband's.......a marriage disclaimer! boxingg

clapp

Jersey Blue

10-25-2010, 05:54 PM

Hey Peg
This Pak, my brit is turning into flushing dog more than a pointing dog. I can't wait to hunt with u guys again this January. May be your dog can teach my dog something.

ptotten

10-28-2010, 10:08 AM

Hey Pak,
What's happening? So you've got that cute lil Brit of yours working, huh? That's great! We're looking forward to the season with high hopes! We know it'll be different with the young one to train, but again, we have high hopes! Great to hear from you...and it isn't even time for a mini meet...lol!
Post a pic of your puppy if you get a chance...I will, too!

Joby

10-28-2010, 08:44 PM

Oops, well I certainly stuck my foot in my mouth. But since nobody has jumped in here AND I do have some experience with doxies. I'll pipe in. First of all, you should always feel free to give Teddy a call. She's by far the most experienced doxie falconer out there (she kinda invented the whole thing as far as I'm concerned). I think the main concern you should have is with two factors. First you have a 12x intermewed RT that might be hard to get started over a mini doxie. I think you might have some challenges here, especially if this is the bird that has hit a much bigger dog. Usually, you try getting them started right off of the trap. You'll have a much better chance of getting the new RT started with the dog than the older one, which could be set in it's ways. Remember to have them near each other when the bird is eating on the ground and during the creance training. This will tell you a couple of things. First, the way that the bird is going to orient itself to the dog (while still having a bit of control). Remember this doxie isn't a veteran dog, but still a puppy. If it gets hit, it could have a much greater impact than if it was a couple of years old. It's much easier to train a new doxie under a bird that won't do too much damage to it if it does bind (like a MHH). I'll send you a PM with my cell number in case you or your husband want to talk some more. There's a lot of variables that I'd want to know before suggesting a course of action.
-Joby

ptotten

10-29-2010, 03:13 PM

Joe, Thanks for your offer of help, we actually do plan on calling Teddy, but you hit my concerns about the "old" RT right on the head! We'll try giving you a call this weekend. Thanks so much for the offer!

ptotten

11-01-2010, 10:31 AM

Okay....we did a little creance training this weekend...
(at this point I think this thread might have to be moved, as it is no longer a "welcome"--LOL!)
First the new hawk out in the yard with the dog on a leash. I had the dog and Paul (my husband) tid-bitted the new hawk (no name yet). We had no problems and the hawk barely even noticed the dog...this was expected.
On to my hawk: Same thing, only Paul took the dog and I tid-bitted my hawk (12X intermewed FRT). Had the creance set up to 80 feet. She was alert and attentive....came each time asked....EXCEPT....She made for the dog about every other time I called her!! So....I guess that's my answer! I'll keep trying to acclimate them, but, like my husband says, what about that one time...while we're out hunting...maybe she's a little low...maybe a little frustrated....maybe a little lazy...

joekoz

11-01-2010, 05:40 PM

Peg:

As someone who has been married to the same woman for 43 years, I loved your "Marriage Disclaimer" posted above!

Conventional wisdom suggests that you spare the pup the potential of getting nailed by your veteran Red Tail, as well as the inevitable "I told you so" references from Paul every time the incident comes up.

New Bird - New Dog PERFECT TOGETHER!

Joby

11-01-2010, 09:50 PM

I'm with Joe here, I kinda saw that coming. The offer is still out there, if you want any specific advice, just give me a call.
-Joby

ptotten

11-03-2010, 10:02 AM

Grrr....come on guys....I'm lookin' for a different answer here! I wanna hear: " sure, Peg it'll be just fine....put that redtail up and get ready for some serious hawking!" Hey, a girl can dream, can't she?? What gives with you guys giving me the same answer as Paul?!?! (My husband)
frus)

ptotten

11-03-2010, 10:03 AM

P.S. I Just saw the "new dog, new bird...perfect together" on your post.....Grrr....ALSO what my husband is saying!! I think I need to go trapping.......again.....

pj_elia

11-05-2010, 01:42 PM

Hey Peg,

This is the other Paul. I've introduced a made bird to a doxie. In the beginning I kept the dog on a short leash or in my arms. Mine did learn that the doxie means rabbits. Others have had success as well while others I know have not. I wouldn't give up if you really want to keep that bird. She may learn. Also, its not the end of the dog if it gets grabbed. I had doxies grabbed by RTs and harris' and seen quite a few others. Non had suffered any damage. Then again, its always good to have an excuse to go trapping.

Good luck.

Paul

Jonathan526

11-06-2010, 05:28 PM

Hey Peg! good to see you're on here. Best of luck with the new team members.

Dirthawking

11-06-2010, 05:37 PM

Okay....we did a little creance training this weekend...
(at this point I think this thread might have to be moved, as it is no longer a "welcome"--LOL!)
...

Naa, just start a new thread! way easier. I have no advise on the dog bird situation as we have the same problem here.

ptotten

11-11-2010, 12:26 PM

Thanks, Paul! That gives me hope. Yeah, I don't want to let her go. She got her first bunny of the season last weekend after ONE creance session and out of the box for only ten minutes!! The old girl picked up like she had never missed a beat! How can I knock that!?!? She has proven herself over and over. However, she has NEVER liked dogs, but she HAS learned to tolerate our Brittany in the feild. Thanks for your viewpoint on doxies getting grabbed...he's just SO SMALL!! I've never had such a small dog before, and I'm afraid he's winnning my heart (okay, so I'm NOT so "afraid") lol! The new little RT is doing great! Hope to see you soon. This wknd is looking like a gr8 one for trapping.

Thomas913

11-11-2010, 12:36 PM

Hi Peg. I am a falconer "just over the Walt Whitman briddge" in Horsham, PA. Nice to meet you. If you have not already, perhaps you can make a PA Falconry meet sometime?

Take care,

Tom

americansharpy

11-16-2010, 03:16 PM

Cape May... Talk about Migration central!!!

joekoz

11-16-2010, 05:39 PM

Cape May... Talk about Migration central!!!

That's for sure. Since September 1st the Cape May Hawk watch has counted over 46,000 birds. You can check out the numbers by type of raptor at http://hawkcount.org/month_summary.php?rsite=328

allterrainwarrior

11-16-2010, 08:39 PM

I don't really miss Jawsy, but I miss fishing the shore. It's great to have you here(welc)

joekoz

11-16-2010, 09:34 PM

I don't really miss Jawsy, but I miss fishing the shore. It's great to have you here(welc)
Jonny:

I noticed on another thread that you mentioned fishing Island Beach and realized you've experienced fishing up here in New Jersey.

If you think fishing the Jersey Shore is good you should experience the waters between New Jersey and New York around the Statue of Liberty from the Verrazanno Narrows Bridge North up the Hudson to the George Washington Bridge. There are times when the fish finder shows almost solid masses of Stripped Bass. I've been out with my brother and his son on his boat where the three of us caught and released 150 Strippers over 24 inches and up to 25 pounds in a 4 hour period in this area. There was a recent catch of a 50 pound Stripped Bass taken beneath the George Washington Bridge that was reported in the Local Fishing news.

ptotten

11-17-2010, 11:21 AM

Holy crap Joe!! That's ALOT of stripers!! Gotta check THAT out!! :eek:

ptotten

11-17-2010, 11:26 AM

joekoz

11-17-2010, 06:41 PM

Holy crap Joe!! That's ALOT of stripers!! Gotta check THAT out!! :eek:

Peg:

Stripper fishing here in New Jersey has been really hot for at least the last 10 years. Since Jersey doesn't always get the respect it deserves here's a fish story that demonstrates what it has to offer.

The first time I really put into a large number of strippers was in early 2001. My brother-in-law and I were out with Al Ristori who is the feature fishing writer for the New Jersey Star Ledger. During that trip I personally boated 47 strippers in the 26 to 34 inch range in just over 2 hours. My brother-in-law boated 36. Al wrote about it the following Sunday in his column. Several months later my brother-in-law called me up to tell me that there was a story written by Al in the June 2001 issue of SaltWater Sport Magazine on page 58 titled “Clam Up for Strippers” where Al credits me with holding the record for catching the most strippers (5) on the same ½ piece of clam. The story behind the story was that we intended to troll for strippers and things were slow so we decided to bottom fish with a small number of clams Al had on board, and we only stopped fishing because we ran out of clams, and I was lucky enough to salvage and get the most out of that last piece.

ptotten

11-24-2010, 01:57 PM

Wow what a great fish story Joe! I personally have not EVER caught a keeper striper. I've caught plenty of foot long ones while creek fishing for white perch (a REALLY fun time out!) And since the breeders go RIGHT BY my dock in the Spring, you would THINK I would have a good chance at them, but they elude me!

allterrainwarrior

11-24-2010, 02:28 PM

Jonny:

I noticed on another thread that you mentioned fishing Island Beach and realized you've experienced fishing up here in New Jersey.

If you think fishing the Jersey Shore is good you should experience the waters between New Jersey and New York around the Statue of Liberty from the Verrazanno Narrows Bridge North up the Hudson to the George Washington Bridge. There are times when the fish finder shows almost solid masses of Stripped Bass. I've been out with my brother and his son on his boat where the three of us caught and released 150 Strippers over 24 inches and up to 25 pounds in a 4 hour period in this area. There was a recent catch of a 50 pound Stripped Bass taken beneath the George Washington Bridge that was reported in the Local Fishing news.

Joe- Good to meet you. Jersey is a fishing paradise for big game species especially striper. I used to live across from Liberty state park on garfield ave. Saw the twin towers from my bed room window and the statue of liberty growing up as a little boy. The Hudson used to be a dump. I am so proud of the interest people have taken to clean the river and the bay up. Striper couldn't tolerate that place two decades ago and now it's a place they go to for vacation. I can't wait to get back up there in Jersey and do some fishing. Is liberty state park along the board walk still a good spot for stripers? I would like to schedule a trip during the season sometime next year.

joekoz

11-24-2010, 05:43 PM

Joe- Good to meet you. Jersey is a fishing paradise for big game species especially striper. I used to live across from Liberty state park on garfield ave. Saw the twin towers from my bed room window and the statue of liberty growing up as a little boy. The Hudson used to be a dump. I am so proud of the interest people have taken to clean the river and the bay up. Striper couldn't tolerate that place two decades ago and now it's a place they go to for vacation. I can't wait to get back up there in Jersey and do some fishing. Is liberty state park along the board walk still a good spot for stripers? I would like to schedule a trip during the season sometime next year.

Jonny:

Seems we have more in common then just Falconry and Stripper Fishing. I grew up in Jersey City on Ocean Avenue. However when I was a kid there was no Liberty State Park, but we did fish for "Tommy Cods" off of the old piers that littered the hudson river shoreline. I suspect that you can catch stripper along the board walk today, but I have no recent experience with shore fishing. All of my recent stripper fishing in the New York Bay area has been with my brother off of his 26 foot Parker.

pj_elia

11-26-2010, 12:24 PM

While I usually fish the area in my 18' Parker I hear that a lot of guys fish the boardwalk and docks in Hoboken and Jersey City for strippers. It seems like they do better at night and mostly use bunker chunks. They do land big ones and have to use a flying gaff to pull it up.

Squirrelhawkin

11-26-2010, 01:57 PM

Thomas913

11-26-2010, 04:35 PM

Hi Tom, thanks for the welcome. My husband, Paul & I attended one of your banquets a few years ago. We didn't make it in time for your meet, but we DID make it in time to catch the Elia boys clean up on your raffle!! Those guys.......

Hi Peg. Two years ago at the Allentown meet I had the first pick for the raffle. I had the choice to take a brittney spaniel (sp?). Knowing I could not come home with a dog (you know the wife's foot up the you know what :)) I instead took a nice framed print of a barbary falcon and gave it to my sponsor. My brothers wanted to hang me for not taking the dog ;)