Quote Originally Posted by andy hall View Post
Here is my question and functional analysis about e-collar use

Did the unwanted behavior significantly reduce in frequency?
yes - then it is punishment
no - then it is abuse

I have used them and even sold them for a few years. Have not touched one in 13 years, and have a much higher success rate for training. The idea of using one for a bird is completely deplorable to me. There is no situation that I could see it being effective with a bird (or almost any animal for training purposes).

Andy
What if I'm using not to stop an un-wanted behavior but to produce a desired behavior?