Blackjack, 2012 Imprint NA tiercel goshawk

[Ally]

I picked up this little guy on Thursday at 16 days old from Lew Souder down in Nevada. First of all, want to mention how AWESOME he is to work with. The pictures and videos ahead of time of the babies was very cool. I had originally been working with Barry over in Wisconsin, but late planning on my part and bad luck on the sex of the babies worked against us. But also, awesome to work with. I've said this before and I'll say it again--I love our falconry community.

Anyway, I will be attempting to follow Steve Layman's philosophy on imprinting. I have a lot of experience with operant conditioning, and am just finishing up my degree in animal behavior. So we'll see how it goes.

So far, we've been "loading" the clicker and building that food pairing. He's only fed from me when he's rocked back on his haunches and his feet are limp. I set the food dish down completely in his line of sight, but as soon as I hold a piece up he will sit back and take it from my fingers. I let him take all that he wants to from my fingertips, and leave the rest in the dish with a little bit of water for hydration.

He's getting more mobile every day, and there's very little that bothers him. Lots of socialization and time around other people and animals. I LOVE this little guy, and am so looking forward to everything I get to experience with him! So, meet Blackjack!

Coming home from the airport


Big day for a baby hawk--already asleep


Playing with an old hood


He walked/scooted halfway across the living room to come play with the string


18 days old, at a friend's BBQ taking in all the new sights


The only time he got a little nervous was when one of the dogs tried to give him a tongue bath--so he came to hide by me


Maybe the dogs aren't so scary afterall


A friend's little girl couldn't get enough of Jack:


That night, he discovered his own reflection:

[BestBeagler]

Looking good! Going to follow this thread with great intrest like I did with Jeff's thread. I didn't know Barry lived in WI I lived down the road from him and I live in MI

[wesleyc6]

Great pics and great looking bird. Congrats!

[Ally]

LOL oops, my fault! I meant MI, I swear I didi

[FredFogg]

Nice Ally! Looking forward to this thread and what I can learn of OC. Man, all these eyas's, you all are killing me!

[Ally]

19 days -

I've been "loading" the clicker with every feeding since Thursday, so tonight I finally decided to see if he understands what the click means. Since I do plan on hood-training him, I decided to use the hood as part of the behavior I was looking for to test his grasp of the idea.

So far he has been very quiet--he chirps and whistles occasionally to talk, but otherwise doesn't make any noise

So I chopped up a sparrow and brought the hood over with me--I feed him wherever he happens to be, whether it's in the nest bowl or wandering around the house. I set it down and he looked at the food and then looked to me (which is exactly what I want him to do). I held the hood up to him near his face and waited for a non-fearful behavior. He whistled at it a little uncertainly, looked at it and looked at me, and then finally stuck his head in to nibble at the beak opening. I marked the behavior and gave him a piece of the sparrow. (At this point he is still sitting on his haunches with limp feet). It took him about 2 repetitions before he defaulted immediately to sticking his head in the hood, and as soon as he heard the click, he looked to me for the food.
The clicker is loaded It's amazing that even in something so young that association can be made so quickly. He's such a good boy

[BestBeagler]

19 days -

I've been "loading" the clicker with every feeding since Thursday, so tonight I finally decided to see if he understands what the click means. Since I do plan on hood-training him, I decided to use the hood as part of the behavior I was looking for to test his grasp of the idea.

So far he has been very quiet--he chirps and whistles occasionally to talk, but otherwise doesn't make any noise

So I chopped up a sparrow and brought the hood over with me--I feed him wherever he happens to be, whether it's in the nest bowl or wandering around the house. I set it down and he looked at the food and then looked to me (which is exactly what I want him to do). I held the hood up to him near his face and waited for a non-fearful behavior. He whistled at it a little uncertainly, looked at it and looked at me, and then finally stuck his head in to nibble at the beak opening. I marked the behavior and gave him a piece of the sparrow. (At this point he is still sitting on his haunches with limp feet). It took him about 2 repetitions before he defaulted immediately to sticking his head in the hood, and as soon as he heard the click, he looked to me for the food.
The clicker is loaded It's amazing that even in something so young that association can be made so quickly. He's such a good boy

Really loving this detail about the OC clicker training keep it up!

[goshawkr]

Congratulations Ally.

Mine is cutter.

[goshawkr]

A friend's little girl couldn't get enough of Jack:

My daughter Heather was about that same age when I brought my old goshawk Angel home at 21 days old. The two were constant companions. My buddy phil dubbed it "the two year old manning technique."

Its amazing the affect a gentle toddler can have on the disposition of an eyass goshawk.

A few years later I used Heather's little brother to raise another calm eyas.

Maybe you should borrow your friend's daughter Ally.

[colelkhunter]

So you are suggesting having a child before you raise an imprint gos? Why didn't you mention this before? I feel so unprepared.

[Kachina]

He's adorable! If you decide you'd like to introduce him to a parrot and cat, bring him on over.

Good luck with him.

[goshawkr]

So you are suggesting having a child before you raise an imprint gos? Why didn't you mention this before? I feel so unprepared.

I just dont have the details listed out well.

Thats one of many reasons why I am not one of the gurus that people are always running to for answers.

There is nothing, and I mean NOTHING like the constant touching that a toddler will give a growing eyas.

My toddlers are all teenagers now, and they dont do nearly as good of a job. Especially since the girls have decided that boys are a lot of fun and have jobs and such.

[goshawks00]

I got to agree with Geoff, little kids are the best babysitters you can have for raising eyas goshawks, I used to rent the neighbors kids when ever i could get them.

As far as entering on parrots and cats, I'd wait at least 3-4 months before doing so.

[colelkhunter]

I am enlisting my local boy scout troop for weekly mauling sessions.

[goshawkr]

I am enlisting my local boy scout troop for weekly mauling sessions.

I'd recomend cub scouts - but supervise them. You want the quite gentle ones, not the rowdy rambunxious ones.

The older boys can do a good job too, but most of them are not as anxious to cuddle and pet. Thats what does the magic.

[Ally]

I'm thinking flagship after school falconry workshop...:-D
Going to take him to the feed store after work today, gotta pick up some dog food and more plastic drop cloth...should be entertaining.

[Kachina]

As far as entering on parrots and cats, I'd wait at least 3-4 months before doing so.

In case anyone else lacks the intelligence to see what's going on, my comment was a JOKE.

Some of y'all take yourselves way too seriously. Try being friendly once in a while.

[goshawks00]

In case anyone else lacks the intelligence to see what's going on, my comment was a JOKE.

Some of y'all take yourselves way too seriously. Try being friendly once in a while.

HA!HA! in case you also lack a sense of humor, as you seem to, so was mine. OR... do you real think I was advocating fur and feather at the same time?

[FredFogg]

Yeee Haaaa, the breeding season is over and the molt is in full force, let the games begin!

[Ally]

Well I got both jokes. And they were funny. So there.
Everybody place nice please!

[Ally]

20 days -

Had to work today, left Jack with some chopped food in his imprint kennel and was able to run home and check on him at lunch. He didn't eat more than a few bites of it on his own, so I brought him out and hand-fed him. He was hungry by this point, so he was making a little noise, but just whistles. If he got too eager about it, I stopped and waited until he was quiet, then marked the "quiet," even if it was only for a second, and gave him a piece.

This is also the first time he's attempted to "chase" down his dish of food, so I followed what Steve talked about during his lecture in Vernal, and turned into the "sibling" by "mantling" over the food dish and guarding it from him. Once he lost interest and sat back on his haunches, I clicked and resumed feeding him until it was gone.

Tonight he came with me to do some shopping--making a new lure so needed some rope, etc. and went to our local feed and farm store. He got SWARMED by the employees and a few customers, got fawned over and petted and messed with. He was nervous when we first walked in, but by 10 minutes into the store he was preening and ready to go to sleep. One person was rubbing his head and if he would have been a cat, I swear he would have been purring. I like him getting his face/head messed with...maybe it will de-sensitize him to the hood later on?

Oh, one thing I forgot to mention--I've also introduced a "no reward" marker (vocal "ah-ah") paired with a negative punishment (withholding of food). For anyone not familiar with OC out there--punishment simply means that the behavior being marked is less likely to continue.

At 20 days he is MUCH stronger on his feet, and I can't believe the feather growth! There's a good inch or better of wing feathers sticking out. Crazy!

Here are some more pictures from the BBQ on Saturday, taken by a friend. The same little girl wanted to feed Jack, but she took one look at the chopped up pieces of sparrow and decided otherwise. So instead, she got a little lesson in OC and learned how to operate the clicker She was a great little helper. Enjoy!

[lewsouder]

Great thread Ally. Decided to sell Grimm and to live vicariously this summer. Please keep the updates coming.

[Ally]

Quick observation from this morning-up to this point his default position has been "sitting" and so marking that correct behavior has been easy. Now that his legs are stronger he's been standing more. When i went to feed him this morning he could NOT figure out why he wasnt getting anything. He nibbled at my hands and turned his head upside down trying to get at the tidbit, and it took him around 2 minutes to finally sit back. The light bulb went off when he earned the click though. Just had to be patient and wait him out.

[FredFogg]

Quick observation from this morning-up to this point his default position has been "sitting" and so marking that correct behavior has been easy. Now that his legs are stronger he's been standing more. When i went to feed him this morning he could NOT figure out why he wasnt getting anything. He nibbled at my hands and turned his head upside down trying to get at the tidbit, and it took him around 2 minutes to finally sit back. The light bulb went off when he earned the click though. Just had to be patient and wait him out.

Ally, trying to learn here so bear that in mind. Why do you want it to sit down before it eats? Are you just doing that now because that is where you started and you are trying to cement the clicker?

[Ally]

Oh whoops, I should definitely explain myself--Jeff Suggs did a great job explaining it in his imprint thread on Apache, so if you want a more detailed/better/different explanation than I might be able to give, you can definitely check there.

One of Steve's observations on goshawks, specifically in parent-chick relationships, is that when a parent is feeding the baby, the baby is always sitting back and has "rubbery" or limp feet while being fed. His thought is to mimick this behavior while hand-feeding, and that by doing this you accomplish 2 things: one, that you have a way to control and keep the bird in the "baby" mindset, and that it also prevents the dreaded face-grabbing. The face grabbing/footing/etc. is demonstrating aggression, and the eyass doesn't show aggression to the parent at this stage in the game, only to its siblings--so by putting the baby in this same frame of mind, it's viewing you as the parent.

As the chicks get older, this changes (young birds chase their parents to get the food, etc.) By conditioning the behavior, you can prolong that baby mindset and keep your "sweet tempered goshawk" longer, and begin conditioning other behaviors as alternative methods to get food rather than him attacking you for it. A few things I remember from Jeff's thread were click/reward for plucking and for chasing and "killing" wads of paper and then, later on, the lure. So you still give the bird an outlet for the growing aggression and hunting instincts, but channel it appropriately for a falconry bird. The tame hack should also help with this A LOT.

I hope I did a good job explaining that...it makes sense in my head but it's hard to put down :P ...does that help?

[FredFogg]

Oh whoops, I should definitely explain myself--Jeff Suggs did a great job explaining it in his imprint thread on Apache, so if you want a more detailed/better/different explanation than I might be able to give, you can definitely check there.

One of Steve's observations on goshawks, specifically in parent-chick relationships, is that when a parent is feeding the baby, the baby is always sitting back and has "rubbery" or limp feet while being fed. His thought is to mimick this behavior while hand-feeding, and that by doing this you accomplish 2 things: one, that you have a way to control and keep the bird in the "baby" mindset, and that it also prevents the dreaded face-grabbing. The face grabbing/footing/etc. is demonstrating aggression, and the eyass doesn't show aggression to the parent at this stage in the game, only to its siblings--so by putting the baby in this same frame of mind, it's viewing you as the parent.

As the chicks get older, this changes (young birds chase their parents to get the food, etc.) By conditioning the behavior, you can prolong that baby mindset and keep your "sweet tempered goshawk" longer, and begin conditioning other behaviors as alternative methods to get food rather than him attacking you for it. A few things I remember from Jeff's thread were click/reward for plucking and for chasing and "killing" wads of paper and then, later on, the lure. So you still give the bird an outlet for the growing aggression and hunting instincts, but channel it appropriately for a falconry bird. The tame hack should also help with this A LOT.

I hope I did a good job explaining that...it makes sense in my head but it's hard to put down :P ...does that help?

Yes, thanks! It just seems like a very slippery slope to me! But I like what I have seen so far because I believe the more we think like the birds, the better we can change our actions to suit what we are doing and want.

[Chris Proctor]

I picked up this little guy on Thursday at 16 days old from Lew Souder down in Nevada.

Just curious why you chose a captive bred Gos over a wild taken bird, (seeing how you live in Montana)?

[Ally]

Chris - combo of lack of time to find a nest and lack of knowledge. I still hope to pull a wild eyass sometime in the future, but I'm going to try to go out with some experienced folks and learn in the meantime so I have a better chance of success.

Update when I get home from work.

[hcmcelroy]

Ally,

Nice descriptions of Blackjack's behavior and with a degree in animal behavior you should be at home. I imprinted a male gos last year and he nibbled on our hands, ran to us to play and had a grand time with the dogs.
I look forward to your adventures and seeing loads of photos...

Thanks, Harry.

[Ally]

22 days --
Blackjack is starting to get a little more vocal and mobile, but I noticed his appetite has almost doubled! So part of that's my fault for not feeding the little bugger enough. He went from only eating about 4 sparrows a day to eating around 8. He got to come to work with me today but had to hang out in the car. We only got up to 65 degrees today so there was no issue with heat. He got to hang out during breaks and lunches and had people coming to say hello and lots of pets and attention. He now has begun automatically defaulting to sitting on his legs to be fed, so I'm going to begin to integrate other behaviors for him to earn some of his meal. Clicking for quiet is going to be one of those, and during the times that I'm home with him I'm going to keep tidbits with me and randomly offer them to him when he's being quiet or doing a behavior I like (like chasing his lure). I'm leaving the lure available for him to see and play with, and in addition to feeding him off of it I'm going to reward for chasing it.


My phone is broken and the camera is in the car, otherwise I'd grab a picture... he's also beginning to display some of what I always thought to be "imprint" actions...he will run over to me for attention, and one of the cats was sitting near him and he kept turning his head upside down to look at her--so cute He's also standing more often than sitting now, and exercising his wings. Will try to go grab a picture of him so you can see the feather growth. I can't believe how much he's grown in just a short week!

[mithril]

Hey Ally, just curious as to your opinion on using a clicker vs a marker word with birds. My experience stems from dog training only, but I prefer using a marker word ('yes' is my preference) because it frees my hands up and is essentially one less thing to carry. I'm aware that there has been "research" that has supported the efficacy of a clicker over a marker word, but in my limited amount of training/experience I have had great success with using just a word. I too "load" the word initially and then proceed from there. Anyway, looking forward to your reply.

[JRedig]

Hey Ally, just curious as to your opinion on using a clicker vs a marker word with birds. My experience stems from dog training only, but I prefer using a marker word ('yes' is my preference) because it frees my hands up and is essentially one less thing to carry. I'm aware that there has been "research" that has supported the efficacy of a clicker over a marker word, but in my limited amount of training/experience I have had great success with using just a word. I too "load" the word initially and then proceed from there. Anyway, looking forward to your reply.

Click with your tongue, hands free always!

[mithril]

Click with your tongue, hands free always!

I do know of some who use this method. Useful for when a clicker isn't allowed in competition.

[Ally]

I am a fan of either one! I totally agree that the hands-free result of a marker word over a clicker is a definite benefit. I like the clicker because of the consistency and distinctiveness of the noise.

Jeff - I can't click loud enough with my tongue! I've tried, I'm awful at it! :P

To keep my hands relatively free, I put the clicker on a wristband so I can click and then drop it. For dogs, you can also hook it to the end of the leash.

Blackjack cuddled up on my lap for a while last night, and then ended up climbing up onto my shoulder and then onto a pillow on the arm of the couch--he's starting to look for "higher" places to be. He was so zonked, rather than disturb him when I went to bed I just moved the pillow onto the floor next to his nest bowl and let him sleep. He was still on it when I woke up in the morning :P

[goshawkr]

Hey Ally, just curious as to your opinion on using a clicker vs a marker word with birds. My experience stems from dog training only, but I prefer using a marker word ('yes' is my preference) because it frees my hands up and is essentially one less thing to carry. I'm aware that there has been "research" that has supported the efficacy of a clicker over a marker word, but in my limited amount of training/experience I have had great success with using just a word. I too "load" the word initially and then proceed from there. Anyway, looking forward to your reply.

"Clicker" has become a set term that limits thinking. The term Skinner used when he formuatled the method was "Conditioned Reinforcer" which is too scientific to really catch on in lay terms.... "Clicker" was popularized by Pryor when she brought Operant Conditioning to the masses because she found that a common child's toy that makes a sharp click works very well, and now of course she is marketing her own clickers that work even better.

Anyway, my basic point is that you should take a step back from the term clicker. Any signal that can be quickly delivered works.