Blackjack, 2012 Imprint NA tiercel goshawk

[Ally]

I picked up this little guy on Thursday at 16 days old from Lew Souder down in Nevada. First of all, want to mention how AWESOME he is to work with. The pictures and videos ahead of time of the babies was very cool. I had originally been working with Barry over in Wisconsin, but late planning on my part and bad luck on the sex of the babies worked against us. But also, awesome to work with. I've said this before and I'll say it again--I love our falconry community.

Anyway, I will be attempting to follow Steve Layman's philosophy on imprinting. I have a lot of experience with operant conditioning, and am just finishing up my degree in animal behavior. So we'll see how it goes.

So far, we've been "loading" the clicker and building that food pairing. He's only fed from me when he's rocked back on his haunches and his feet are limp. I set the food dish down completely in his line of sight, but as soon as I hold a piece up he will sit back and take it from my fingers. I let him take all that he wants to from my fingertips, and leave the rest in the dish with a little bit of water for hydration.

He's getting more mobile every day, and there's very little that bothers him. Lots of socialization and time around other people and animals. I LOVE this little guy, and am so looking forward to everything I get to experience with him! So, meet Blackjack!

Coming home from the airport


Big day for a baby hawk--already asleep


Playing with an old hood


He walked/scooted halfway across the living room to come play with the string


18 days old, at a friend's BBQ taking in all the new sights


The only time he got a little nervous was when one of the dogs tried to give him a tongue bath--so he came to hide by me


Maybe the dogs aren't so scary afterall


A friend's little girl couldn't get enough of Jack:


That night, he discovered his own reflection:

[BestBeagler]

Looking good! Going to follow this thread with great intrest like I did with Jeff's thread. I didn't know Barry lived in WI I lived down the road from him and I live in MI

[wesleyc6]

Great pics and great looking bird. Congrats!

[Ally]

LOL oops, my fault! I meant MI, I swear I didi

[FredFogg]

Nice Ally! Looking forward to this thread and what I can learn of OC. Man, all these eyas's, you all are killing me!

[Ally]

19 days -

I've been "loading" the clicker with every feeding since Thursday, so tonight I finally decided to see if he understands what the click means. Since I do plan on hood-training him, I decided to use the hood as part of the behavior I was looking for to test his grasp of the idea.

So far he has been very quiet--he chirps and whistles occasionally to talk, but otherwise doesn't make any noise

So I chopped up a sparrow and brought the hood over with me--I feed him wherever he happens to be, whether it's in the nest bowl or wandering around the house. I set it down and he looked at the food and then looked to me (which is exactly what I want him to do). I held the hood up to him near his face and waited for a non-fearful behavior. He whistled at it a little uncertainly, looked at it and looked at me, and then finally stuck his head in to nibble at the beak opening. I marked the behavior and gave him a piece of the sparrow. (At this point he is still sitting on his haunches with limp feet). It took him about 2 repetitions before he defaulted immediately to sticking his head in the hood, and as soon as he heard the click, he looked to me for the food.
The clicker is loaded It's amazing that even in something so young that association can be made so quickly. He's such a good boy

[goshawkr]

A friend's little girl couldn't get enough of Jack:

My daughter Heather was about that same age when I brought my old goshawk Angel home at 21 days old. The two were constant companions. My buddy phil dubbed it "the two year old manning technique."

Its amazing the affect a gentle toddler can have on the disposition of an eyass goshawk.

A few years later I used Heather's little brother to raise another calm eyas.

Maybe you should borrow your friend's daughter Ally.

[colelkhunter]

So you are suggesting having a child before you raise an imprint gos? Why didn't you mention this before? I feel so unprepared.

[Kachina]

He's adorable! If you decide you'd like to introduce him to a parrot and cat, bring him on over.

Good luck with him.

[goshawkr]

So you are suggesting having a child before you raise an imprint gos? Why didn't you mention this before? I feel so unprepared.

I just dont have the details listed out well.

Thats one of many reasons why I am not one of the gurus that people are always running to for answers.

There is nothing, and I mean NOTHING like the constant touching that a toddler will give a growing eyas.

My toddlers are all teenagers now, and they dont do nearly as good of a job. Especially since the girls have decided that boys are a lot of fun and have jobs and such.

[goshawks00]

I got to agree with Geoff, little kids are the best babysitters you can have for raising eyas goshawks, I used to rent the neighbors kids when ever i could get them.

As far as entering on parrots and cats, I'd wait at least 3-4 months before doing so.

[colelkhunter]

I am enlisting my local boy scout troop for weekly mauling sessions.

[Kachina]

As far as entering on parrots and cats, I'd wait at least 3-4 months before doing so.

In case anyone else lacks the intelligence to see what's going on, my comment was a JOKE.

Some of y'all take yourselves way too seriously. Try being friendly once in a while.

[lewsouder]

Great thread Ally. Decided to sell Grimm and to live vicariously this summer. Please keep the updates coming.

[Ally]

Quick observation from this morning-up to this point his default position has been "sitting" and so marking that correct behavior has been easy. Now that his legs are stronger he's been standing more. When i went to feed him this morning he could NOT figure out why he wasnt getting anything. He nibbled at my hands and turned his head upside down trying to get at the tidbit, and it took him around 2 minutes to finally sit back. The light bulb went off when he earned the click though. Just had to be patient and wait him out.

[FredFogg]

Quick observation from this morning-up to this point his default position has been "sitting" and so marking that correct behavior has been easy. Now that his legs are stronger he's been standing more. When i went to feed him this morning he could NOT figure out why he wasnt getting anything. He nibbled at my hands and turned his head upside down trying to get at the tidbit, and it took him around 2 minutes to finally sit back. The light bulb went off when he earned the click though. Just had to be patient and wait him out.

Ally, trying to learn here so bear that in mind. Why do you want it to sit down before it eats? Are you just doing that now because that is where you started and you are trying to cement the clicker?

[Ally]

Oh whoops, I should definitely explain myself--Jeff Suggs did a great job explaining it in his imprint thread on Apache, so if you want a more detailed/better/different explanation than I might be able to give, you can definitely check there.

One of Steve's observations on goshawks, specifically in parent-chick relationships, is that when a parent is feeding the baby, the baby is always sitting back and has "rubbery" or limp feet while being fed. His thought is to mimick this behavior while hand-feeding, and that by doing this you accomplish 2 things: one, that you have a way to control and keep the bird in the "baby" mindset, and that it also prevents the dreaded face-grabbing. The face grabbing/footing/etc. is demonstrating aggression, and the eyass doesn't show aggression to the parent at this stage in the game, only to its siblings--so by putting the baby in this same frame of mind, it's viewing you as the parent.

As the chicks get older, this changes (young birds chase their parents to get the food, etc.) By conditioning the behavior, you can prolong that baby mindset and keep your "sweet tempered goshawk" longer, and begin conditioning other behaviors as alternative methods to get food rather than him attacking you for it. A few things I remember from Jeff's thread were click/reward for plucking and for chasing and "killing" wads of paper and then, later on, the lure. So you still give the bird an outlet for the growing aggression and hunting instincts, but channel it appropriately for a falconry bird. The tame hack should also help with this A LOT.

I hope I did a good job explaining that...it makes sense in my head but it's hard to put down :P ...does that help?

[FredFogg]

Oh whoops, I should definitely explain myself--Jeff Suggs did a great job explaining it in his imprint thread on Apache, so if you want a more detailed/better/different explanation than I might be able to give, you can definitely check there.

One of Steve's observations on goshawks, specifically in parent-chick relationships, is that when a parent is feeding the baby, the baby is always sitting back and has "rubbery" or limp feet while being fed. His thought is to mimick this behavior while hand-feeding, and that by doing this you accomplish 2 things: one, that you have a way to control and keep the bird in the "baby" mindset, and that it also prevents the dreaded face-grabbing. The face grabbing/footing/etc. is demonstrating aggression, and the eyass doesn't show aggression to the parent at this stage in the game, only to its siblings--so by putting the baby in this same frame of mind, it's viewing you as the parent.

As the chicks get older, this changes (young birds chase their parents to get the food, etc.) By conditioning the behavior, you can prolong that baby mindset and keep your "sweet tempered goshawk" longer, and begin conditioning other behaviors as alternative methods to get food rather than him attacking you for it. A few things I remember from Jeff's thread were click/reward for plucking and for chasing and "killing" wads of paper and then, later on, the lure. So you still give the bird an outlet for the growing aggression and hunting instincts, but channel it appropriately for a falconry bird. The tame hack should also help with this A LOT.

I hope I did a good job explaining that...it makes sense in my head but it's hard to put down :P ...does that help?

Yes, thanks! It just seems like a very slippery slope to me! But I like what I have seen so far because I believe the more we think like the birds, the better we can change our actions to suit what we are doing and want.

[Chris Proctor]

I picked up this little guy on Thursday at 16 days old from Lew Souder down in Nevada.

Just curious why you chose a captive bred Gos over a wild taken bird, (seeing how you live in Montana)?

[Ally]

Chris - combo of lack of time to find a nest and lack of knowledge. I still hope to pull a wild eyass sometime in the future, but I'm going to try to go out with some experienced folks and learn in the meantime so I have a better chance of success.

Update when I get home from work.

[hcmcelroy]

Ally,

Nice descriptions of Blackjack's behavior and with a degree in animal behavior you should be at home. I imprinted a male gos last year and he nibbled on our hands, ran to us to play and had a grand time with the dogs.
I look forward to your adventures and seeing loads of photos...

Thanks, Harry.

[Ally]

22 days --
Blackjack is starting to get a little more vocal and mobile, but I noticed his appetite has almost doubled! So part of that's my fault for not feeding the little bugger enough. He went from only eating about 4 sparrows a day to eating around 8. He got to come to work with me today but had to hang out in the car. We only got up to 65 degrees today so there was no issue with heat. He got to hang out during breaks and lunches and had people coming to say hello and lots of pets and attention. He now has begun automatically defaulting to sitting on his legs to be fed, so I'm going to begin to integrate other behaviors for him to earn some of his meal. Clicking for quiet is going to be one of those, and during the times that I'm home with him I'm going to keep tidbits with me and randomly offer them to him when he's being quiet or doing a behavior I like (like chasing his lure). I'm leaving the lure available for him to see and play with, and in addition to feeding him off of it I'm going to reward for chasing it.


My phone is broken and the camera is in the car, otherwise I'd grab a picture... he's also beginning to display some of what I always thought to be "imprint" actions...he will run over to me for attention, and one of the cats was sitting near him and he kept turning his head upside down to look at her--so cute He's also standing more often than sitting now, and exercising his wings. Will try to go grab a picture of him so you can see the feather growth. I can't believe how much he's grown in just a short week!

[mithril]

Hey Ally, just curious as to your opinion on using a clicker vs a marker word with birds. My experience stems from dog training only, but I prefer using a marker word ('yes' is my preference) because it frees my hands up and is essentially one less thing to carry. I'm aware that there has been "research" that has supported the efficacy of a clicker over a marker word, but in my limited amount of training/experience I have had great success with using just a word. I too "load" the word initially and then proceed from there. Anyway, looking forward to your reply.

[lewsouder]

Hey Fred...didn't know if any other falconers worked for Lowe's. I created a forum for Lowe's falconers when connections first became available but didn't get any response. Nice to feel not so alone:-)

[Ally]

Ha ha, well I will have to check Lowe's next time! It's right across the street. :P

We picked up my buddy's imprint peregrine from the airport on Friday, like I was saying, and the two babies are only 4 days apart (peregrine is older) but the differences in development surprised me. The peregrine was VERY steady on his feet, and tried to foot the crap out of me when I went to touch him.

Blackjack, on the other hand, still isn't steady on or experimenting as much with his feet. I gave him just an opened-up sparrow this morning to see what he'd do with it, and he picked at it with his beak for a minute, then looked at me like, "Mom, help?"

So I sat down with him and cut little pieces off the sparrow and fed him that way. Now he's wandering around the house.

[FredFogg]

Hey Fred...didn't know if any other falconers worked for Lowe's. I created a forum for Lowe's falconers when connections first became available but didn't get any response. Nice to feel not so alone:-)

I work at the Data Center in Winston-Salem and to tell you the truth, haven't even looked at Connections! LOL I am at work now and sit here in front of a computer from 7 p.m. until 7 a.m., too busy on NAFEX to look at Connections!

[Ally]

Happy Father's Day (belated) to all of your dads out there

Spent the evening with my parents and brought Jack along for the ride. Lots of attention, pets, and visual stimulation. Neighbor kids, plus mom, plus grandparents came over to meet Jack, and the little girl was running around and riding her bike in circles around his nest bowl. Her older brother had a skateboard. Jack didn't bat an eyelash at the movement, bright colors (flourescent pink bike :P) or at all the attention. The kids petted him everywhere and my mom had a camera in his face the whole time. He finally got tired and went to sleep by his nest bowl.

He chased a leaf around the yard and even pounced on it and started footing it--the first real sign of using his feet that I've seen. I'm going to start watching for and marking the behavior when I see it, and introduce chasing and catching the lure and other toys. Thus far he's had access to the lure to play with if he wanted it, but we haven't focused on associating it with food yet. That's going to be our next step this week. Still occasionally bringing the hood out and marking for reaching into the hood, but not pushing it until he gets a bit older.

As far as noise level goes, he chirps occasionally when he's bored, but the only real noise he makes is some whistles when he's being fed. Last night right before bed he let out one really loud "kakakakakak," but the room was dark and I didn't see anything around, so I don't know what alarmed him. Didn't stand up or move--maybe he was having a bad dream? :P

[Ally]

Eureka, we had a breakthrough today. Tied half a sparrow to his lure and he tried to pull at it with his beak for a few tries before he finally put a foot on it and began to tear it up. He's been footing the towel in his nest bowl and all kinds of other small things today. He's also testing his wings more and more.

I clicked to mark movement towards the lure, and marked the act of putting his feet on the food. He got snagged up by the cartiledge in the chest cavity, so I reached in and took that piece from the lure and broke it up into smaller pieces and offered it to him. He didn't care a bit.

Back to the parents house tonight for a good friend of the family in town. More dogs, more people, more pets and attention.

[spygirl]

Ally, I just wanted to say that I am thoroughly enjoying your thread and am very interested to see how the clicker training turns out. It may be a couple of years before I can jump back into falconry, so I'm living vicariously through NAFEX!

[Richard]

Hey Fred...didn't know if any other falconers worked for Lowe's. I created a forum for Lowe's falconers when connections first became available but didn't get any response. Nice to feel not so alone:-)

Chuck Butler works for Lowe's in Pueblo, Colorado.

[FredFogg]

Chuck Butler works for Lowe's in Pueblo, Colorado.

I think all Lowe's falconers living in goshawk territories should help other Lowe's falconers get a passage goshawk this fall! LOL

[Ally]

LMAO. Nothing like instilling a bit of fear to really get the paranoia worked up.

Well, Jack just had his first real flight tonight AND, I caught it on video! It's not much, but it's the first real flying he's ever done From the dog house to the top of the weathering. Will post the vid when I figure out how to do it.

He had JUST finished his dinner on the lure and was running around the yard footing everything that wasn't the grass, and up he jumped to the top of the dog house, and a few minutes later, up he went again O.O. Scared the crap outta me because he had just eaten! Thankfully he stepped onto the glove when I reached up for him and I put him back in his weathering. He will get a longer time out tomorrow with some short, non-removable jesses and a tranny.

He mauled the lure for his dinner and started to mantle again...gah. Same procedure as this morning, preventing the self-reward until he settled down and clicking/feeding tidbits for calm, slicked down behavior intermittent with his dinner.

I'm going to start splitting his training sessions--one will be a large meal fully on the lure, when he is called down from his hack. The other will be used as tidbits for OC games--hooding, tidbit hunting, and parent/eyass relationship work for now, and as he gets stronger will be working in restrained pursuits for exercise. I'll try to get pics and/or videos of that as well

I think by making the switch to almost everything on the lure I lost a little bit of that relationship...I notice it in little things, like his posture when I approach and the beginnings of mantling on the lure...and as things are going to go into overdrive I really want to try to maintain it. In hindsight, this is what I should have been doing all along instead of switching almost exclusively to the lure. So here we go

[wingnut]

I've really enjoyed reading your thread Ally. I admire the time and effort you are putting into OC training. And also the time you take to post pics and dialogue. It really seems like a lot of work and if you'll humor me for a moment, perhaps a lot of work that really does not change the finished product. By comparison, and this is only based rearing two other imprint goshawks and the one I am currently rearing of which the final product is yet to be assesed. My first gos I raised before anyone even knew what OC was or who McDermit was and she did all those things that we strive for in a quiet, well mannered imprint. I had a stupid attack and traded her for a peregrine when she was 7 and like ten years later the guy called me and when she was killed and wanted me to start him another one. The last male I had I raised the same way. In the house until the down started flying and then in the mew and my shop and lots of baggies prior to penning. He was a quiet, solid, killing machine. No bad habits. I'm doing the same thing with my current male. He's about 50 days old, flying him free and killing baggies. No weight control yet. He spends half the day in the mew, half the day in my shop mostly by himself, and the night in the mew. It's really pretty easy. I'm sure your bird will turn out awesome and I hope mine will too.

[JRedig]

Thanks for keeping this up Ally, having fun reading it! That goes for all the baby threads really, love baby raptors!!!

[hcmcelroy]

Isaac,

Stormy Huddelson DVM of Tucson researched frounce some years ago and found that the freezer did not kill the organism and that it was found all over the body of the pigeon. Not limited to the digesive track. I've fed frozen pigeon for decades and suffer an infected hawk now and again but one shot of med and its stopped and with a few days it is gone.

Harry.