Traditional tethering vs. Clip Swivel tethering

[Tasha55403]

To clarify...is that 2 setups attached to the ring? Each clip goes into a jess, right? To make it more secure (but a little more difficult to maneuver) could you use coastlock swivels instead of the dog clips? I've used a similar setup for years and never had any problems with those.

[BestBeagler]

To clarify...is that 2 setups attached to the ring? Each clip goes into a jess, right? To make it more secure (but a little more difficult to maneuver) could you use coastlock swivels instead of the dog clips? I've used a similar setup for years and never had any problems with those.

I have had everything but a traditional set up fail me I have tried them all. Luckily I all the fails happened in my hand via inspection. The coastlocks get brittle with continual use where they bend the opening and closing of them at the bend causes them to weaken over time just like any wire. Just sharing an experience here. I won't use anything else but a traditional swivel now.

Pineo swivel with a paracord fox leash with weed eater line insert for stiffness is for me the ideal.

I have never figured out why leather leashes are looked down on? Wouldn't a leather jess break before a leather leash? Leather leashes are stiff and that's a good thing.

Not all directed at you you Tasha I know you have been a falconer for awhile.

Ever since I lost my first peregrine by him untying his paracord leash off his perch I just can't trust a knot completely. Fox leash for me.

We all take risks we are comfortable with though. The risks I take might be frowned upon by some. I have seen a common mind set of falconers that I admire though.

[rkumetz]

I have had everything but a traditional set up fail me I have tried them all. Luckily I all the fails happened in my hand via inspection. The coastlocks get brittle with continual use where they bend the opening and closing of them at the bend causes them to weaken over time just like any wire. Just sharing an experience here. I won't use anything else but a traditional swivel now.

Pineo swivel with a paracord fox leash with weed eater line insert for stiffness is for me the ideal.

I have never figured out why leather leashes are looked down on? Wouldn't a leather jess break before a leather leash? Leather leashes are stiff and that's a good thing.

Not all directed at you you Tasha I know you have been a falconer for awhile.

Ever since I lost my first peregrine by him untying his paracord leash off his perch I just can't trust a knot completely. Fox leash for me.

We all take risks we are comfortable with though. The risks I take might be frowned upon by some. I have seen a common mind set of falconers that I admire though.

Isaac,
Falconry is pretty much all about managing risks. No matter what you do and even with careful attention to husbandry detail you can have problems. I think that every piece of equipment has pros and cons. As you point out the falconer's knot is not infallible event when tied correctly and backed up.

I am not a big fan of leather or natural materials in general. Rock climbers abandoned leather harnesses and natural fiber ropes because both can fail without any significant sign of wear - the materials simply degrade and fail.

As for clip leash arrangements they have certain benefits when you are pressed for time (a clip is better than a knot tied in a hurried fashion) and when you need to make sure your tethering arrangement is of a certain length. As someone pointed out, the coastlock snap is probably a lot more reliable than glove snaps and luggage strap hooks.

[BestBeagler]

Isaac,
Falconry is pretty much all about managing risks. No matter what you do and even with careful attention to husbandry detail you can have problems. I think that every piece of equipment has pros and cons. As you point out the falconer's knot is not infallible event when tied correctly and backed up.

I am not a big fan of leather or natural materials in general. Rock climbers abandoned leather harnesses and natural fiber ropes because both can fail without any significant sign of wear - the materials simply degrade and fail.

As for clip leash arrangements they have certain benefits when you are pressed for time (a clip is better than a knot tied in a hurried fashion) and when you need to make sure your tethering arrangement is of a certain length. As someone pointed out, the coastlock snap is probably a lot more reliable than glove snaps and luggage strap hooks.

Not getting on a high horse here, as I have used all kinds of clips but the reason we use clips is because we are lazy. No falconer should be that short of time. The traditional method of using flying jesses with zero holes is the best and what a way to condition a bird on a kill than to trade out jesses while eating? Will I use snaps in the future? I don't know? Its an improvement for me to work on not using them. I have used a mini link carabiner that is as good as I can get. Still, there are those holes in the jesses that are always a risk. Not throwing any stones here. Like I said, we all take risks we are comfortable.

[rkumetz]

Not getting on a high horse here, as I have used all kinds of clips but the reason we use clips is because we are lazy. No falconer should be that short of time. The traditional method of using flying jesses with zero holes is the best and what a way to condition a bird on a kill than to trade out jesses while eating? Will I use snaps in the future? I don't know? Its an improvement for me to work on not using them. I have used a mini link carabiner that is as good as I can get. Still, there are those holes in the jesses that are always a risk. Not throwing any stones here. Like I said, we all take risks we are comfortable.

Isaac,
We do this for the pleasure it gives us so I can't see anyone being in a rush but as you know "shit happens" and sometimes situations become confusing.

I worked with a guy who was the most responsible breeder of golden retrievers you could imagine. One day his daughter burned herself on a radiator and in the confusion his wife let a bunch of goldens out in the yard with their Welsh springer spaniel who proceeded to take care of the golden in heat for them. All of a sudden he is a breeder of hokey hybrids despite the best of intentions. Stuff happens. Same thing with falconry.

In reality tethering a bird outside unprotected is taking a pretty big risk
even if your tethering system doesn't fail.

Ron

[BestBeagler]

Isaac,
We do this for the pleasure it gives us so I can't see anyone being in a rush but as you know "shit happens" and sometimes situations become confusing.

I worked with a guy who was the most responsible breeder of golden retrievers you could imagine. One day his daughter burned herself on a radiator and in the confusion his wife let a bunch of goldens out in the yard with their Welsh springer spaniel who proceeded to take care of the golden in heat for them. All of a sudden he is a breeder of hokey hybrids despite the best of intentions. Stuff happens. Same thing with falconry.

In reality tethering a bird outside unprotected is taking a pretty big risk
even if your tethering system doesn't fail.

Ron

Like most falconers I don't weather in the open unless I am within the earshot and ideally within eyesight. With the Albidus I am flying now he never is weathered alone EVER. Yes stuff happens it's up to each of us to decided what we feel is risky. I am on the extreme risk averse side when it comes to falconry. If I weather a bird in a weathering yard or if I am camping or what have you the transmitter is always turned on. If I would have had a transmitter turned on when my peregrine untied himself I would have found him. Our experiences shape our behaviors and risk tolerances.

Like our birds its a struggle to avoid the path of least resistance.

[BestBeagler]

Here's an intresting looking security snap I am not sure how it works though?
http://www.cetreria.com/foro/files/9...0e5542d99de15f

[Tasha55403]

I have had everything but a traditional set up fail me I have tried them all. Luckily I all the fails happened in my hand via inspection. The coastlocks get brittle with continual use where they bend the opening and closing of them at the bend causes them to weaken over time just like any wire. Just sharing an experience here. I won't use anything else but a traditional swivel now.

That's part of the reason there's two of them-redundancy is your friend. My bird's are never tethered outside unsupervised. Even if I trusted the equipment I don't trust local predators. I've had one coastlock fail and come unlatched a couple times in the mew (they were always still hooked into the leather jess though), but never two. And that's with using them on big, strong birds like redtails and goshawks for years and years. ANY equipment can fail, it's the falconers job to make sure it's not a disaster if it does and to do what they can to keep it from happening in the first place.