But wait, there's more

[haggardgyr]

Privilege comes from the Latin privus lege, or, private law. We don't have a system of private law in the U.S. A revolution was fought over it; the distinction is not small. Just because rights are legally restricted, (i.e. free speech is a right but you can't yell 'fire' etc.) does not make it less of a right. Just because you have to prove that you're not a danger to others on the road doesn't make driving a privilege. You have the right to own property, but that doesn't mean you can do anything you want with it. When we get into the mindset that the government can and should bestow privilege, in we're in big trouble.

Man's rights come from God, Nature, or Nature's God....take your pick. Government does not create rights, nor can it take them away. A moral government is one that recognizes and insures a defense of rights.

Ron Kearney

[rkumetz]

Man's rights come from God, Nature, or Nature's God....take your pick. Government does not create rights, nor can it take them away. A moral government is one that recognizes and insures a defense of rights.
Ron Kearney

So now that you are here on NAFEX to do your own bidding, exactly how do the falconry regulations interfere with my 1st amendment rights? If I want to go to a boy scout troop and talk about falconry with a bird on my fist I am able to do so and not only that, they can reimburse me for my gas. Getting paid to do presentations is not even remotely within the scope of a falconry permit. More importantly if you wish to use birds for presentations and get paid you can simply get an educational permit for about $100 per year. The same price you paid for the special purpose abatement permit that you use to get paid to use your birds to do abatement. It is called the cost of doing business. If you are not going to make at least $100 doing those commercial activities then you might want to simply ask for gas money anyway.

I am really tired of hearing the "you can't tell me what to do" crowd telling me that I am ignoring my rights being trampled so I am either irresponsible or ignorant.
There are never any details forthcoming.

Like for example, why has AFC / PLF chosen to go to federal court with plaintiffs who just imagine that their rights might be violated when the video poster boy was allegedly invaded by armed storm troopers
and another falconer wet herself because she was not allowed to leave the room to prevent her from flushing her 3-186's. Or might it be that those people are either not interested in participating
or oooh wait... maybe they are not as innocent as the PLF would have you believe? Maybe the judge would have actually issued a warrant anyway?

Let's ditch the smoke and mirrors show. We are not as ignorant or apathetic about our rights as these promotional threads would lead people to believe.

[dboyrollz76]

So now that you are here on NAFEX to do your own bidding, exactly how do the falconry regulations interfere with my 1st amendment rights? If I want to go to a boy scout troop and talk about falconry with a bird on my fist I am able to do so and not only that, they can reimburse me for my gas. Getting paid to do presentations is not even remotely within the scope of a falconry permit. More importantly if you wish to use birds for presentations and get paid you can simply get an educational permit for about $100 per year. The same price you paid for the special purpose abatement permit that you use to get paid to use your birds to do abatement. It is called the cost of doing business. If you are not going to make at least $100 doing those commercial activities then you might want to simply ask for gas money anyway.

I am really tired of hearing the "you can't tell me what to do" crowd telling me that I am ignoring my rights being trampled so I am either irresponsible or ignorant.
There are never any details forthcoming.

Like for example, why has AFC / PLF chosen to go to federal court with plaintiffs who just imagine that their rights might be violated when the video poster boy was allegedly invaded by armed storm troopers
and another falconer wet herself because she was not allowed to leave the room to prevent her from flushing her 3-186's. Or might it be that those people are either not interested in participating
or oooh wait... maybe they are not as innocent as the PLF would have you believe? Maybe the judge would have actually issued a warrant anyway?

Let's ditch the smoke and mirrors show. We are not as ignorant or apathetic about our rights as these promotional threads would lead people to believe.

[ericedw]

If I want to go to a boy scout troop and talk about falconry with a bird on my fist I am able to do so and not only that, they can reimburse me for my gas.

I'm not arguing whether it violates my 1st amendment rights or not, I'm not a lawyer or more importantly a judge, but in FL this isn't true. Part of the issue here is we all operate under slightly different rules in our particular state. In FL I am not allowed to take my bird to a school, boy scout troop or anywhere without a separate "Wildlife Exhibition" permit. Whether I'm getting paid or doing it for free. I have to buy a $50 permit. I don't know CA laws either. I know the federal rules allow it but that doesn't matter if the state doesn't.

[rkumetz]

I'm not arguing whether it violates my 1st amendment rights or not, I'm not a lawyer or more importantly a judge, but in FL this isn't true. Part of the issue here is we all operate under slightly different rules in our particular state. In FL I am not allowed to take my bird to a school, boy scout troop or anywhere without a separate "Wildlife Exhibition" permit. Whether I'm getting paid or doing it for free. I have to buy a $50 permit. I don't know CA laws either. I know the federal rules allow it but that doesn't matter if the state doesn't.

As it turns out, I very recently had some discussions with a law professor who seems to differ with PLF on the matter.
Now you and I know that lawyers fatten their retirement accounts by arguing things until the cow comes home so that in itself is not surprising.
It is really too bad that my daughter wasn't being paid to disagree when she was a teenager because that would have paid for college.

The 1st amendment issue hinges upon whether or not it is your free speech that is being squashed. In this case, it is not. What is not permitted is the use of your bird held on a falconry permit which
does not (in your state) allow you to use that bird for purposes other than falconry. You can stand behind a podium, on a soap box or dangle from a trapeze by your knees and TALK about falconry
if you don't bring your bird.

Of course in a practical sense your state is shooting itself in the foot because any time they can get someone to go out and get the general population enthusiastic
about wildlife it is in their own best interest. I disagree with their policy but it is reaching to say that it infringes upon your 1st amendment rights.

[dboyrollz76]

Man's rights come from God, Nature, or Nature's God....take your pick. Government does not create rights, nor can it take them away. A moral government is one that recognizes and insures a defense of rights.

Ron Kearney

This is funny, But due to the terms of nafex I can’t address it from a religious point. But I can say we are capable of knowledge and love to make educated decisions, to be a lawful and just people. To obey the laws of the land. If you obey the laws of the land, then you should have no worries or fears of what may come crashing through the door.

[frigginchi]

Assuming those that are doing the crashing have your same beliefs. lol

This is funny, But due to the terms of nafex I can’t address it from a religious point. But I can say we are capable of knowledge and love to make educated decisions, to be a lawful and just people. To obey the laws of the land. If you obey the laws of the land, then you should have no worries or fears of what may come crashing through the door.

[rkumetz]

Assuming those that are doing the crashing have your same beliefs. lol

I don't mean this in a disrespectful way but it seems that your state seems to have a disproportionate number of issues with this whole armed storm troopers inspecting
things issue. Given that they pay for commercials that portray y'all as laid back dudes with no worries in the world that seems sort of odd.

Is there some sort of attitude prevalent in CA government which causes this? Is it an issue outside of falconry?

Given the absurd disclaimers about carcinogenic substances that everyone has to use to sell any sort of product in CA I am given to believe that it can't
be just falconry.

You seem to be pretty well informed and a thoughtful sort of fellow so I would appreciate you sharing your thoughts as a CA resident.