Teaching a Bird to hunt? Advise?

[threetoe]

For an apprentice, I sure have had a learning curve. As most know, I fired my first sponsor.

This year after SEVERAL knowledgeable Master Falconers have watched my bird fly and seen the interaction between myself and my 1X Intermewed RT, they have come to the conclusion that I did NOT obtain a BRANCHER from the Rehab center but actually took transfer of an IMPRINT.
The rehab center took this Female from Animal Control (along with her brother) and were "told" that they were found on the ground and fully feathered. (bull) What happened to her before they got her is a mystery.

These Falconers have ALL raised, trained and flown imprints and they all agreed that the behavior exibited by this bird is NOT THAT OF A BRANCHER. She acts and reacts EXACTLY like an Imprint.

This answers SEVERAL nagging questions of mine in regards to why she acts like she does.
: She flies so hard but doesn't connect. She resumes chases.
: Her flight window is a country MILE wide. (not easy for an apprentice because the "window" of a passage bird is tiny compared to that of an imprint)
: She chases, crashes the brush like a warrior but can't seem to catch one.
: She checks off game at the same weight she crashed the brush at the other day.
: She attacks me at times.
: Her constant screaming when she sees me.


So....
Im now attempting to "teach" her to hunt and make success her normal thing. I am using the advise of a REAL Falconer.

(All the "advise" I got from my former sponsor and all the training was bubkus)

I'm trying to trap some bunnies but all I seem to catch is opossums and skunks.

I'm told that I need to put her on several "Bags" (in a row) to build her lagging confidence, teach her that when she gets one of her own that she eats till full and make her crazy to take game. In between Bags I'm flying her for exercise with a weighted leash.

Is there any tid-bits you guys can add? I appreciate constructive input.

[Jimmy]

: She flies so hard but doesn't connect. She resumes chases.
: Her flight window is a country MILE wide. (not easy for an apprentice because the "window" of a passage bird is tiny compared to that of an imprint)
: She chases, crashes the brush like a warrior but can't seem to catch one.
: She checks off game at the same weight she crashed the brush at the other day.
: She attacks me at times.
: Her constant screaming when she sees me.

Sounds like a bird that isn't at the right weight to me. Imprint, brancher, passage or otherwise.

[outhawkn]

I appreciate constructive input.

Well heck,that leaves me out.........................


I'd lower the weight and get her on a couple baggies for sure. Then I'd keep close track of her weight (not starving, but hungry enough that she is serious)and hunt her.

[Saluqi]

Hi Bill,

What I've heard about imprint redtails is that they tend to be fearless when it comes to slaying game, so from what you are describing she doesn't really sound like a "typical", whatever that is, imprint redtail. Keep in mind that all birds can develop imprint like behaviors as you describe your bird having. I've heard of plenty early taken passage RTs that scream and food beg and are somewhat aggressive. These bigger birds (redtails, ferrugs, etc.) remain parent dependent well into the fall of their first year.

One of things that I've found with falconry birds is that life is too short to be wasting your time on mediocre birds. There are lots of redtails out there who love catching rabbits and all sorts of other game, why not cut your losses and trap a new bird. It's one thing for a very experienced falconer to take on a "project" bird, but when you are learning it's best, for you and the project bird, to fly a bird that behaves more typically.

[goshawks00]

I am kind of the same mind set as Paul....BUT... I would like to know first, has she EVER killed any thing?

You might get some bags from all the experts around you, and toss her a bag in the mews and just leave her alone to figure it out. Short of that give her some mice and make sure she can at least kill game, then dump her and get a real hunting hawk not someone elses problem.
Imprint attitudes in Rts can be bad news.
.02
Barry

[wesleyc6]

I agree with what I have read. If you feel like you just have to make this bird hunt, then fly the "bottom" of that country mile wide weight window. On most passage birds, this is where you should start anyway IMHO.

Bag the bird on some game. Once it gets to killing some bags and has some skill and you are at weight, she should start catching game. I always though of bags as a way to train to chase and give confidence, not really to teach "how to catch" as much. If she is chasing game sometimes and not others, then you are playing on HER terms. I always like to be on MY terms when I can.

Regardless, I wouldn't have ever started with a brancher or imprint unless I had a great sponsor that perfered them.

[Jimmy]

If I recall correctly, she killed on her own while she was lost once...... So to me, that points to a falconer error why she won't catch now. Impossible slips, wrong weight, etc, come to mind.

[outhawkn]

One of things that I've found with falconry birds is that life is too short to be wasting your time on mediocre birds. There are lots of redtails out there who love catching rabbits and all sorts of other game, why not cut your losses and trap a new bird. It's one thing for a very experienced falconer to take on a "project" bird, but when you are learning it's best, for you and the project bird, to fly a bird that behaves more typically.

This would be my first choice for sure. But I mentioned that in another thread.............................thier isnt anything to be gained from keeping this bird,except ....frus

[goshawks00]

If she knows to kill as Jimmy says... then cut her or toss her..life is to short for this type of headache... unless you really....REALLY.... want/need the challenge
.02
Barry

[virdz]

WITH ALL DUE RESPECT, I get mad when I read comments from falconers advising you to just "give away" this great opportunity to fly an imprint RT. I have trained a couple including an eyass male, and by far, this eyass surpassed in tenacity, fearlesness and endurance any of the passages. I would FIRST see if the bird already knows how to kill and if it knows what is all about. It´s not the same to kill a rat than a full grown rabbit (the big species). So, first things first and just let him kill a rabbit in the most naturall way possible (in a field), at this time it doesn´t matter much if it runs a lot or not, you are just evaluating her and leting her loose all doubts. Many times I´ve had birds that would "chase hard but not connect" and WITHOUT dropping a gram, I´ve had these same birds killing in no time, it´s just a matter of confidence and eliminating fear, they might chase by instinct but still be a little afraid of connecting or holding. If you burn out this few grams now, later on you might not have more to burn when something else arises. I don´t like to resolve everything with just dropping weight, that is the easy way out and not always the best. When given the baggies, let her have a good crop (but not really full) and DON´T excersise her to glove or lure in between baggies or you WILL loose the momentum gained, just wait 1-2 days for her actual weight to come back, then go out to find reall quarry and if nothing caught, get the baggie prepared( it is important to have the baggie at hand, if for example she flyes a bunny into a bush and she crashes and the bunny escapes, pretend you are wacking the bush to erflush (even if you know the bunny is lost) and without her seeing, plant the bunny so she thinks its the same one she chased, this teaches her to be persistent, to expect reflushes, to build confidence and hunting bond with the falconer. If you wait all day for her to get discouraged at failed attempts and THEn you plant an easy baggie for her to kill, you are teaching your bird all the wrong things.
I hpe I have explained myself, although I learnt English since very young, it is not my first language so sometimes I feel i don´t transmit exactly what I want. I think most of the advices given from experienced falconers are good and sound, just don´t rush the weight issue and KEEP the bird and next season remember this post

[Raptorick]

Sounds like you now have some good help, so I don't want to be redundent. A few things to do...

I would not feed her on the fist anymore if you are. Have her look for her own food off your glove directed away from you.

Baggies will be needed and or take her to easy hunting areas that have cotton rats etc....anything that directs food away from you.

If she always gets an easy meal from you, she won't try so hard. If your feeding her on the fist all the time then she will get aggressive and want more.

Drop her wieght some and don't feed her on the fist. Make her work for It! I don't like that attacking thing. Shes frustrated and wants you to feed her.

or get a new one!

Good luck!