You are absolutely correct. I didn't read that carefully. I apologize.

However, after reading it again several times, I still disagree with your "3 second" statement, but this time the opposite way. I personally don't think reward can be delivered fast enough without a CR. How on earth will the bird know what it is doing correct if you aren't hitting a CR the moment the behavior happens? 3 seconds is an eternity. If you are shaping a sharpy, there could easily be 20 behaviors in 3 seconds.

From my experience, timing is SOOOO important that any time between the behavior and the CR is too long. The CR needs to occur at the very same moment the behavior does. I believe it is so important that when I'm shaping, I will form my mouth so all I have to do is blow for the whistle to happen. Otherwise, the time it takes me to form my mouth, inhale and blow is far too long to properly reinforce the behavior that I was looking for.

With regard to you being offended by me calling you a "woman," you may want to lighten up. I'm sure you've been called much worse over the course of your life. If you haven't, you are very lucky. I definitely have. And by the way, you didn't read it carefully. I didn't call you "that woman." I called you "the woman." This should lessen how much I've offended you, but if you're still offended by my use of the word "woman," I truly apologize.

All jabbing aside, the fact of the matter is, I was in the middle of writing the post and when it came to writing your name, I wasn't able to see it above the text on my screen and I couldn't remember it (too many blows to the head from women that I've offended over the course of my life). Furthermore, I was concerned the if I hit my "back" button, it would have erased my writing and I would have had to start over.

Quote Originally Posted by Ally View Post
Toby, you were not reading carefully. I also would appreciate being referred to by my name, as it is signed at the bottom of my post per forum rules, and not 'that woman.'

I said the time between the REWARD and the behavior is only about 3 seconds to make the association. I then followed said statement with one that said using a clicker, or CR, gives you more time to reward.

My meaning came across a little skewed when I said the timing between the click and the tidbit was important--and it still is, there should be a tidbit following each click, but it doesn't have to to be nearly as fast as without the CR.

Kitana provided a great source for the information, and I received my information through my education at Animal Behavior College and through my behavioral psychology degree, since you asked.

Maureen -
The behavior has been shaped since the day I got him, to be patient and wait for my to feed him. He is a full-food imprint using Steve Layman's method--my log is under the Imprinting forum, titled "Blackjack, 2012 tiercal NA goshawk" or something similar. Good luck with your RT!