Things you would like to see from NAFA?

[FredFogg]

In order for folks to help make NAFA a better organization, let's list things we would like to see changed within NAFA or things we would like to see NAFA do that they are not currently doing. Let's not ramble about general things, if you can't be specific about a topic, don't say anything.

To start, on another thread, one was talking about the survey they did and how nothing was done about that survey. Well, from my understanding, one of the biggest complaints of the last survey was NAFA members didn't have access to when their membership was up and when they would need to renewal or if their information was correct. NAFA heard this complaint and you now can look up your membership information on the website.

NAFA can't make changes if the members don't let them know what needs to be changed. NAFA can't start doing something they never did before if members don't ask for it. So let them know what you think and maybe some good ideas will come out of this and with several NAFA directors on here, they can put things in motion.

I will start by saying I would like for NAFA to think about having regional meets. They could partner with a different state in each region and that state could pretty much put on the meet but with a little help from NAFA. NAFA would still have its yearly meet, but this would give folks that don't want to travel to the middle of the US and opportunity to go to a large meet in their own back yard.

[Dirthawking]

One of my concerns was updating of information/knowing what is going on besides waiting for the newsletter. Seems like Larry has taken care of that one!

[GONEHAWKN]

i am with the regional meet thing too. i did the drive out to Texas once and it was the last time i would or will ever do it. i would rather save my time and gas money and hunt locally. i have said it before, i aint gonna drive 30 hours to hunt rabbits.

[Mike O]

I'd like to see all of the old Journal and Hawk Chalk articles published online and indexed by subject and key words.

Here's an example of what has been done with some old birding journals:

http://elibrary.unm.edu/sora/

[Flatwater Falconer]

I'd like to see all of the old Journal and Hawk Chalk articles published online and indexed by subject and key words.

Mike, I believe this idea is being worked on as we speak of it! It might take some time of course there are years of issues to deal with. Have you viewed the recent issues on the web site?

All the best,

[Flatwater Falconer]

i am with the regional meet thing too. i did the drive out to Texas once and it was the last time i would or will ever do it. i would rather save my time and gas money and hunt locally. i have said it before, i aint gonna drive 30 hours to hunt rabbits.

Have you spoken with your director about your idea? I think it's a great idea but unless you communicate with your area director or a director-at-large how do you think anyone will propose this at a board meeting? Your director is the exact person who could bring this up for serious discussion at the next board meeting.

All these electronic channels we talk on are fun but it boils down to taking responsibility and actually phoning your director and having an actual conversation.

[Mike O]

Mike, I believe this idea is being worked on as we speak of it! It might take some time of course there are years of issues to deal with. Have you viewed the recent issues on the web site?

All the best,

I have and while the emagazines are nice they are not indexed and are not searchable. What really makes online journals valuable is the ability to search for content when you don't know what issue it might be in.

[Flatwater Falconer]

Ok yes I see what you mean Mike. I too am anticipating being able to search when doing studies or looking for specific topics.

In the mean time, Bill Oakes has a CD which, while slightly primitive and slightly out of date with recent issues, does an admirable job of indexing and categorizing by subjects, authors and more, all the 'Chalks from many years back. You can get in touch with Bill at EagleWing Publishing. com

[goshawks00]

There ares several issues I wish NAFA would work on...We are all falconers , we love to hunt our hawks, What could be more normal than to want to experience what ever breed we want...

1)Fill in the blank..... I would love to fly ----on --- game.. With the many, many different species of raptors available to falconers world wide ... I dream of the day that we, as individual falconers, could import , privately, what ever species we fancy... It is that way in the UK and I suppose ( not sure) many of the other European conutries... In fact I believe it is possible to do so even in Canada.. Get rid of the need to belong to some co-op and the need to do a special assessment of what ever species your co-op would like to import.

2) Get rid of the institutional quarantining at Federally run site... Several years ago , when i imported my Euro Spars... I did so through Canada... I had a friend there and we were able to build a quarantining site in his old garage, it was approved and inspected by thee Canadian equivalent of USFWS and approved. I brought in 10 spars there and the total cost of quarantining was less than $200.00 total... In the states it would have cost close to $2000.00 and tons of paper work and governmental BS to accomplish... Not to mention just trying to set of times and available quarantining chambers needed to do so.. Why on God's little green apple can't private citizens be able to do their own quarantining.... Luckily for me it was only 40 miles from my house to get to the spars and I visited them regularly...
That is a couple of issues NAFA could get involved with that would catapult our falconry into the 21st century instead of where we all languish now..
.02

[Hawkmom]

I agree with regional meets and such. The NAFA meet would be the 'big convention' but local regional meets in each directorate or state would be nice too. Pennsylvania has one of the largest falconry meets east of the MS. When I was in Maryland in the 80's. Enjoyed it each year.

[Flatwater Falconer]

I agree with regional meets and such. The NAFA meet would be the 'big convention' but local regional meets in each directorate or state would be nice too.

Regional meets . . . sounds like a great idea. Why not flesh out a serious plan and pitch it to your area director? With some concrete points and a direction to follow it would probably be something to consider seriously. To merely say "Hey! Do regional meets," is to plop a HUGE project onto a board which already spends many hours on Association biz.

So I'd suggest make a plan and pitch it. Factor in everything you can think of - location ideas, hotel, weathering yard situation, game availability, hawking permit/hunting license requirements by local governments game depts, meet chairs, frequency, publicity, registration teams, raffle, vendor, etc etc for each and every location we might like to see a regional meet. If the ground work were done and there was some show of support then why wouldn't the idea fly?

[Rise25]

There ares several issues I wish NAFA would work on...We are all falconers , we love to hunt our hawks, What could be more normal than to want to experience what ever breed we want...

1)Fill in the blank..... I would love to fly ----on --- game.. With the many, many different species of raptors available to falconers world wide ... I dream of the day that we, as individual falconers, could import , privately, what ever species we fancy... It is that way in the UK and I suppose ( not sure) many of the other European conutries... In fact I believe it is possible to do so even in Canada.. Get rid of the need to belong to some co-op and the need to do a special assessment of what ever species your co-op would like to import.

This.

[goshawkr]

Regional meets . . . sounds like a great idea. Why not flesh out a serious plan and pitch it to your area director? With some concrete points and a direction to follow it would probably be something to consider seriously. To merely say "Hey! Do regional meets," is to plop a HUGE project onto a board which already spends many hours on Association biz.

So I'd suggest make a plan and pitch it. Factor in everything you can think of - location ideas, hotel, weathering yard situation, game availability, hawking permit/hunting license requirements by local governments game depts, meet chairs, frequency, publicity, registration teams, raffle, vendor, etc etc for each and every location we might like to see a regional meet. If the ground work were done and there was some show of support then why wouldn't the idea fly?

Donna,

Its not a new idea. Its been bouncing around NAFA for a long time. Its been in the hawk chalks both in the form of members writting in to try and get the idea to take fire, and in the form of directors looking to see if there is interest.

Its also been done. Around 10 years ago the North Pacific Directorate held a regional meet that was a smashing success. And then the director that organized it left office and the new director didnt puruse another one.

It takes momementum to get these things going....and it takes desire to keep them going.

[goshawkr]

1)Fill in the blank..... I would love to fly ----on --- game.. With the many, many different species of raptors available to falconers world wide ... I dream of the day that we, as individual falconers, could import , privately, what ever species we fancy... It is that way in the UK and I suppose ( not sure) many of the other European conutries... In fact I believe it is possible to do so even in Canada.. Get rid of the need to belong to some co-op and the need to do a special assessment of what ever species your co-op would like to import.

Thats a good one Barry. It would be very simple to resolve. All that needs to be done is to press HARD on the FWS to get raptors excempted from Wild Bird Conservation Act. Apart from that, the Wild Brid Conservation Act should be fixed so that it only applies to wild birds, and not captive bred birds.

[ericedw]

Regional meets . . . sounds like a great idea. Why not flesh out a serious plan and pitch it to your area director? With some concrete points and a direction to follow it would probably be something to consider seriously.

This has been pitched by board members many times over the years. Once while I've been a director, I think it was Rob Sulski that pitched it and I fully support the idea. But it's always been voted down.

I think it would be a fantastic way to increase membership by making NAFA more relevant on a local level. This was even pitched at our Strategic Planning meeting at the NAFA meet.

I hope we'll get enough directors to support this one of these days and I suspect as more open minded directors are elected this will become a reality one of these days.

[Saluqi]

Thats a good one Barry. It would be very simple to resolve. All that needs to be done is to press HARD on the FWS to get raptors excempted from Wild Bird Conservation Act. Apart from that, the Wild Brid Conservation Act should be fixed so that it only applies to wild birds, and not captive bred birds.

Really? There are no CITIES issues involved?

[MrBill]

The sad thing about going to a NAFA meet is that it is costly, particularly if you are coming from any distance; this in itself limits membership participation, particularly nowadays. So, the idea of regional meets is attractive. However, I'm not sure if NAFA has the resources to make their presence known in a meaningful way each year at various meets throughout the country; it is, after all, a volunteer organization, with only a little over a thousand member in the States. But, having "regional meets" is, in itself, a good idea (IMHO).

BTW, someone mentioned not wanting to drive any distance to a NAFA meet simply to hawk what they can hunt at home, and that makes sense. But, I think those who continually go to NAFA meets do so for the comradarie as much as the hawking. It's certainly a gathering that everyone should attend, at least once.

Bill B.
Norman, OK

[frootdog]

BTW, someone mentioned not wanting to drive any distance to a NAFA meet simply to hawk what they can hunt at home, and that makes sense. But, I think those who continually go to NAFA meets do so for the comradarie as much as the hawking. It's certainly a gathering that everyone should attend, at least once.

Bill B.
Norman, OK

True. I could stay at home and catch 2-3 times the amount of game that I normally take at a NAFA meet, BUT there is usually the opportunity to hunt new or different quarry, IE jacks. The people is what keeps me coming back year after year. Also being from TX I don't get a lot of opportunity to see goshawks or gyrs fly so there is that benefit too.

One reservation i would have about regional meets would be the cost. Yes in theory they (meets) make money, but first money has to b e spent to find out if it would be a success or not. The organization has already stated that funds are tight and this would be a gamble at best. It could be a cash infusion or it could be a total bust.

[goshawkr]

Really? There are no CITIES issues involved?

Oh, CITIES can and often does become involved, but the blocker that stops the importation of raptors into the US is the Wild Bird Conservation Act.

CITIES comes into play with all international trade between member nations involving the listed species. And CITIES can be a pain, but its just a simple matter of the exporter getting permits certifing that the wild populations were not impacted. But CITIES isnt a show stopper.

The Wild Bird Conservation Act is a US law that was ostensibly written to protect parrots from extreme exploitation by the pet trade. The WBCA forbids the importation of any protected bird species unless 1) its being imported into a conservation co-op as breeding stock or 2) it is being exported by an approved (by the USFWS) foreign facility and as far as I know, there are none dealing with raptors. I am mildly suprised that there hasnt been anyone trying to expoit this opening, but perhaps there just isnt enough of a US market to make it worthwhile.

How raptors got tied in to the WBCA is a bit baffling, but I have heard many point a finger at NAFA for dropping the ball. This is probably not completely fair, but I also havent seen any evidence that NAFA has picked up the cause and tried to remedy things. I, like Barry, would love to see NAFA take this up. The best way to do that is find someone passionate about it and simply give them an endorsement to speak in NAFAs name.

[Saluqi]

What about the AFC? Are they still working on issues? They seemed to come on strong on a variety of fronts, are they working any of these things?

[ukroper]

...$65..A NIGHT (with breakfast!!!) IN DODGE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!....................... ......

[joekoz]

Chris L.

There seems to be a lot of interest in border state and regional meets. Haven’t heard back from you regarding the following PM that I sent to you several days ago.

Chris:

Not sure you caught my post #20 in Joby's thread below. Non-The-Less, would like your thoughts regarding your sanctioning the idea of a Mid-Atlantic States Regional NAFEX Meet if I were to put the time and effort into organizing it.

My BIG idea! http://www.nafex.net/showthread.php?t=8024

JoeKoz

I’ve identified a central location with:

• Lot’s of available Public Gameland.
• A new Comfort Inn with $49.00 weekday and $64.00 Friday and Saturday 2 person room rates

And thought that the above factors in addition to scheduling it early in the season on Saturday - November 19th and Sunday - November 20th (weekend prior to Thanksgiving) meet might draw a decent turnout.

[FredFogg]

One reservation i would have about regional meets would be the cost. Yes in theory they (meets) make money, but first money has to b e spent to find out if it would be a success or not. The organization has already stated that funds are tight and this would be a gamble at best. It could be a cash infusion or it could be a total bust.

This is where NAFA pairs with a different state in each region. NC hold 3 meets every year, one year we could be the Southeast Meet state and paired with NAFA, could hold a regional meet. We would find the spot, find the hotel, pretty much do all the work that NAFA does and all NAFA would have to do is maybe help us organize it. The funds made during the auction could be divided between NAFA and the state putting on the meet thus helping the state putting on the meet afford to put on the meet. Each year a different state holds the regional meet. If a state doesn't want to hold one, they don't have to participate. It can be done, but yes, it will take some work.

[goshawkr]

One reservation i would have about regional meets would be the cost. Yes in theory they (meets) make money, but first money has to b e spent to find out if it would be a success or not. The organization has already stated that funds are tight and this would be a gamble at best. It could be a cash infusion or it could be a total bust.

Any well planned meet will not cost any money at all. I have planned plenty of them for my state club, and its a very simple matter to make them cost neutral.

It DOES take time and effort to plan them, but thats not part of the cost I am talking about.

The planner talks to a hotel, and gets a group rate, then quotes that group rate to the attendees. Hotel costs nothing.

The planner contacts a resturant and finds the cost of hosting a meal in a banquet room, and ideally gets that quoted per person, and then passes those costs on to the participants by collecting banquet fees up front. Again, not cost to the org.

Gathering some informal places to meet for non-banquet meals is even easier - find out who has the room, and tell everyone they are on their own at those locations for their meals.

Its effort, but its easy and its simple.

[joekoz]

Any well planned meet will not cost any money at all.

Its effort, but its easy and its simple.

Have run a number of quickly organized adhoc events, and this has been my experience as well.

Unless I'm mistaken, most on here would be happy with an opportunity to get together with other falconers in a setting where there is an opportunity to socialize and fly their birds on game.

[frootdog]

Any well planned meet will not cost any money at all. I have planned plenty of them for my state club, and its a very simple matter to make them cost neutral.

For smaller clubs this may be true. I'm used to working on NAFA meets and Texas meets and we DO spend money to make the experience better. Well planned has nothing to do with cost. Can you put on a no cost to the club meet? Yes. Are the meets where money is spent by the club better? I can't answer that since I've never participated in one of those.

Like Donna said gather all the details and pitch it to your director, or the board as a whole.

I'm not opposed to the idea, don't get me wrong however if there were a regional NAFA meet in or near Texas, I would not attend. I only have so much vacation and between my other hawking trips I would not be able to swing it. Same is most likely true if the NAFEX meet ever comes to fruition. I would love to and one day when I am retired then it may happen but until then I have to pick and choose.

[FredFogg]

I'm not opposed to the idea, don't get me wrong however if there were a regional NAFA meet in or near Texas, I would not attend. I only have so much vacation and between my other hawking trips I would not be able to swing it. Same is most likely true if the NAFEX meet ever comes to fruition. I would love to and one day when I am retired then it may happen but until then I have to pick and choose.

The good thing about a regional meet is it doesn't have to be an entire week. Maybe Thursday through Sunday?

[Steve L.]

The best way to do that is find someone passionate about it and simply give them an endorsement to speak in NAFAs name.

I nominate you Geoff!

[frootdog]

The good thing about a regional meet is it doesn't have to be an entire week. Maybe Thursday through Sunday?

True. And not to be a total naysayer, but it's also more strain you put on raffle donors. Eventually they are going to say no, and at what cost? They donate to the regional meet where the funds get split potentially and they decide not to donate to the big meet. How many times do you expect donor x to donate to NAFA be it the national meet or x# of regional meets. Or they donate to those meets at the expense of cutting NCFG out of the mix. Just saying it's not as easy as saying it could be free, it can be done. There are potential pitfalls. It's not all roses.

[FredFogg]

True. And not to be a total naysayer, but it's also more strain you put on raffle donors. Eventually they are going to say no, and at what cost? They donate to the regional meet where the funds get split potentially and they decide not to donate to the big meet. How many times do you expect donor x to donate to NAFA be it the national meet or x# of regional meets. Or they donate to those meets at the expense of cutting NCFG out of the mix. Just saying it's not as easy as saying it could be free, it can be done. There are potential pitfalls. It's not all roses.

I am a half glass full guy! Well, that is until I tip it up and drink that half glass of bourbon!

[frootdog]

I am a half glass full guy! Well, that is until I tip it up and drink that half glass of bourbon!

Like I said I'm all for it, just pointing out some reasons why it's not just that easy. I think a lot of people say hey what about us in the PNW, east coast, north east, etc but don't see the bigger picture.

[goshawkr]

True. And not to be a total naysayer, but it's also more strain you put on raffle donors. Eventually they are going to say no, and at what cost? They donate to the regional meet where the funds get split potentially and they decide not to donate to the big meet. How many times do you expect donor x to donate to NAFA be it the national meet or x# of regional meets. Or they donate to those meets at the expense of cutting NCFG out of the mix. Just saying it's not as easy as saying it could be free, it can be done. There are potential pitfalls. It's not all roses.

Why does that matter? Why does there have to be a raffle at all?

If there is a raffle, and the proceeds go to NAFA, who freakin cares if it detracts from the donations to the main meet? If it steals attendance from the main meet, who cares?? Its still fostering face to face comraderie, and its still raising funds going into the war chest.

Or one could just use this as an excuse to give up....

Either way, its no skin off my back. I am not currently a NAFA member - I resigned as a protest two years ago - and I wouldnt be invited because NAFA is rather snobby that way with their functions.

[FredFogg]

Why does that matter? Why does there have to be a raffle at all?

If there is a raffle, and the proceeds go to NAFA, who freakin cares if it detracts from the donations to the main meet? If it steals attendance from the main meet, who cares?? Its still fostering face to face comraderie, and its still raising funds going into the war chest.

Or one could just use this as an excuse to give up....

Either way, its no skin off my back. I am not currently a NAFA member - I resigned as a protest two years ago - and I wouldnt be invited because NAFA is rather snobby that way with their functions.

Geoff, with the changes that have been made and are being made, why don't you rejoin? Holding grudges from stuff that happened 2 years ago, well, my father said it best, "Get over it son, tomorrow is a new day!!".

[goshawkr]

I nominate you Geoff!

I wouldnt be a good choice. I am not really passionate about importing raptors. I have some pipe dreams, and I am on a breeding co-operative, but I really have no real passion for them. At least not now.

But I do know some who would be, if they still have the spare energy. Although most of the people I would list off are so pissed at how NAFA has handled the WBCA and how it applies to raptors that it would be difficult to persuade them to come inside NAFA to help out. Fun little catch .22 there....

[Eagle Owl]

Why does that matter? Why does there have to be a raffle at all?

If there is a raffle, and the proceeds go to NAFA, who freakin cares if it detracts from the donations to the main meet? If it steals attendance from the main meet, who cares?? Its still fostering face to face comraderie, and its still raising funds going into the war chest.

Or one could just use this as an excuse to give up....

Either way, its no skin off my back. I am not currently a NAFA member - I resigned as a protest two years ago - and I wouldnt be invited because NAFA is rather snobby that way with their functions.

No offense, Geoff, but with an attitude like that I am glad you aren't a NAFA member. Krys is merely pointing out the potential problems that would/could exist if there were regional meets. People have said they want regional meets and don't see any problems with having them, Krys is merely playing devils advocate. He never said it is a dumb idea that would never work. Is it not a good idea to look at all sides of a potential issue to see the negatives and positives. If you just jump in head first, without looking at it from all sides, the you are just setting yourself (in this case NAFA) for failure.

Besides, if you don't care, then why are you on here complaining about it in the first place?